How do I stop this thing from leaking????!!!!

[djsamuel]

Today, we were getting ready for a trip from Florida to Arizona and Utah. We loaded the camper with what we could since we weren't plannin on leaving for a few days yet.  A typical Florida thunderstorm came along, so we went inside and had dinner.  After the rain, I decided to give the camper one last check to make sure there were no more leaks.


I was shocked to walk in and see a LOT of water dripping from both lights over the bed, and to see the storage area over the bed with water in it.  My driveway has a bit of a slant to it, so the water would be running from the right side to the left (driver's) side.  It started raining again, and I got a ladder to see what was going on with the roof.  Because of the lousy way LivinLite fits the aluminum sheeting to the corners, the water just pools up there.  Other than spending a fortune on DICOR self leveling sealant to fill in that are where the water pools, what can be done to stop this?  I see no area where the DICOR is bad, and no matter what, on a trailer that is a year old, this is a disgrace.  To say I am P***ed off is an understatement.


I paid a huge premium for this trailer.  We would have been better off getting a Coachman, or a Jayco.  It's not too often I feel like I've been ripped off, but this is one of those times.  


I put this in the "Ask the Factory" section hoping they would respond, but even though they requested this section, their participation is at about the same level as the quality of their products.

[leslie]

I am sorry to hear that you have had this problem. However, by posting here, you have alerted the rest of us. I will contact my dealer to ask that when my camper is delivered, the techs pay particular attention to the seams and the roof area. Has your warranty expired?

[djsamuel]

Hi Leslie. Unfortunately, we are scheduled to leave for Arizona in a couple of days, which coincides with one year since we got the camper. No time to get it to a dealer, but I think I found the issue. I'll be replacing an area of sealant on the roof tomorrow (DICOR self leveling sealant) so hopefully it will take care of this once and for all.

I'm really glad I found it today rather than while we were driving across the country. The Camplite are very solid campers, but given what they cost, I was hoping for less problems than this. Hopefully I'll get this taken care of and yours will be fine.

[funpilot]

As I have posted before, I would call the factory directly to let them know what happened.  I agree with you that it appears that it is hit or miss on their monitoring this forum, let alone responding to it. I am hopeful for you that it is one source of the leak that you can get fixed and that solves it for you. I will certainly soak the roof of my trailer when I go to inspect it next week.  

[funpilot]

[quote source="/post/3373/thread" timestamp="1410137845" author="@djsamuel"] The Camplite are very solid campers, but given what they cost, I was hoping for less problems than this. Hopefully I'll get this taken care of and yours will be fine. [/quote][p]We all know they are more costly and it is rational to expect with premium pricing should come premium quality, but this entire industry does not appear to understand the adage of "Get it right the first time".  As such, I do not believe there is that much correlation between quality and price on stuff that should never go wrong in the first place. I can only hope we have fewer of those events with our LL than other owners do rather than the proper expectation that there should be ZERO manufacturing defects on many of the items I see reported here.   I have toured several factories now and it is amazing how much is done by hand and with no apparent state of the art quality control that we have learned to expect in other industries.  Putting it another way, if the aviation industry had the same QC as the RV industry, it would be highly likely that fasteddie and I would not be here.[/p][p]
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[leslie]

I am going to edit my maintenance schedule to include a trip to the dealer just before the warranty expires for the purpose of a thorough inspection to have any issues resolved while the camper is still covered by the warranty.

Thanks, dj, and here's hoping you have a great time on your trip.

[djsamuel]

[quote source="/post/3375/thread" timestamp="1410138570" author="@funpilot"][quote source="/post/3373/thread" timestamp="1410137845" author="@djsamuel"] The Camplite are very solid campers, but given what they cost, I was hoping for less problems than this. Hopefully I'll get this taken care of and yours will be fine. [/quote][p]We all know they are more costly and it is rational to expect with premium pricing should come premium quality, but this entire industry does not appear to understand the adage of "Get it right the first time".  As such, I do not believe there is that much correlation between quality and price on stuff that should never go wrong in the first place. I can only hope we have fewer of those events with our LL than other owners do rather than the proper expectation that there should be ZERO manufacturing defects on many of the items I see reported here.   I have toured several factories now and it is amazing how much is done by hand and with no apparent state of the art quality control that we have learned to expect in other industries.  Putting it another way, if the aviation industry had the same QC as the RV industry, it would be highly likely that fasteddie and I would not be here.[/p][p]
[/p][p] 
[/p][/quote]While I agree with your statement, I would say that I certainly don't expect a 100% defect free product.  As an engineer for the last 34 years involved with military aviation, I've become very familiar with design margins, reliability, manufacturing defects and processes, etc.  However, while I do not expect strict state of the art quality control standards, I do expect workmanship and good design, especially in a more expensive unit such as a Camplite.  Otherwise, what are we paying for?  For example, when you get your camper, remove the internal air conditioning cover.  Out of the 8 screws that hold that cover in place, only 2 are gripping anything more than the Azdel.  Look at how many scraps of aluminum are left lying around the camper (unless your dealer does a great cleaning job).  In terms of design, take a look at how the perimeter of the roof is higher than the the aluminum sheeting that makes up the roof itself; causing water to pool right along the sealed edge.  Or if yours is like many others, why do they use a steel strap to hold the piping from the black tank in place?  It will be the only rusted strap there.  While the galvanic potential between mild steel and aluminum is not very large, the possibility for galvanic corrosion exists there.  Why not use another means of anchoring the pipe?  

I overlooked many of these issues because of the basic design of the Camplites.  If I had a similar leak in a more conventional camper, I would have the potential for a lot more damage.  Thankfully, I won't have to deal with that.  However, we have a reason to expect higher quality, and that is cost.  The fact that the industry has no quality control processes is not an excuse, especially in higher priced campers.  That should be expected.  In fact, I do expect premium pricing to be associated with a product that is superior in design AND quality.  That does not mean zero defects.

[djsamuel]

OK, I found the leak.  I'll post a picture so others can see what to look for.


Now I just need to hit Camping World and pick up some DICOR self leveling sealant.  Shouldn't be a difficult fix.  

[funpilot]

I agree that zero defects as a blanket statement is not reasonable.  However, mistakes like what you (and many others have found) on caulking are simply not acceptable above zero for me. This is just a reflection of how behind the times the industry is as this kind of flaw is common place.  I know how to make it go to zero and it would be a huge marketing ploy for a manufacturer to support:  Have a list of guaranteed items that they not only fix, but issue cash payments to the customer if uncovered at the PDI. I would expect a rook leak would be worth $2,000 on a camplite. Instead of being angry, the customer might even purr ... Of course, any smart manufacturer would make sure that there is never any reason that an item on their list ever has a payment because it was not an issue in the first place.

So, roof leaks, wiring should be perfect, window leaks, door leaks, appliances work, no plumbing leaks, etc. are some that come to mind.  When is the last time any of us have had any similar basic problem like this with a new car?  I have never had any leaks or wiring being done incorrectly in a car or truck I have owned in the last 20 years.  

 

[charliem]

[font size="3"]Doug,

I'm glad you found, and presumably can fix, the leak. I looked at mine and the sealing seems OK, but I can see where it could become an issue. I'll keep eyes on it over time and be prepared with a tube of Dicor handy. Happy camping.   
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[solds88]

dj,

What is that extremely heavy gray goop that LL is using to seal the roof seams?? I hope it's not silicone, as silicone won't stick to itself when you're trying to repair it. So, it's doubtful that Dicor  will stick if the existing sealer is silicone based. In the past I have removed all the silicone from the joint, labor intensive, and refilled the seam with Dicor and then applied EternaBond tape over the entire seam. If you're careful and take your time when you're applying the EternaBond it will look great. Once the tape touches the roof it's pretty much a done deal. Consequently, I use blue painters tape to make the layout lines. It's expensive, but in my opinion it works better than caulk.  

[djsamuel]

James,

The grey stuff appears to be Dicor.  It is definitely not silicone.  LivinLite does in fact use silicone on the vertical surfaces; why I don't know.  I've replaced the silicone with Proflex RV.  I thought about the Eternabond, but when I found the leak, figured I'd go with the Dicor.  If I still have issues, I may try the eternabond, but am a bit concerned about how well I can seal the outboard edge of the tape, since the Camplites have a bit of a unique edge, and I wouldn't be able to wrap the tape around it at all.  I could end it flat and apply Dicor along the edge.  I may still do that when the job is more than a spot repair.

Thanks for the input.

Doug

[djsamuel]

[quote source="/post/3396/thread" timestamp="1410193690" author="@charliem"][font size="3"]Doug,

I'm glad you found, and presumably can fix, the leak. I looked at mine and the sealing seems OK, but I can see where it could become an issue. I'll keep eyes on it over time and be prepared with a tube of Dicor handy. Happy camping.   
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Thanks Charlie.  I applied the Dicor this morning.  If it still leaks, I will have absolutely no idea how it is getting in.  I think I eliminated all potential paths.

Hopefully we'll be ready to head out in a couple of days.

Doug

[djsamuel]

Just wanted to give an update.  We had a very heavy thunderstorm this evening, heavier than the rain that resulted in the leaking last night.  The camper's position was not changed at all from last night.  Not one drop of water leaked in tonight.  Looks like I have this taken care of.  We're looking good for the trip now.

Doug

[funpilot]

AWESOME