Water Heater Question

[lanell]

[p]  [span]    [/span]We have the gas/electric water heater in our 16DB , the gas comes on and heats as it should with the switch with the separate light  . The AC element did not heat and after testing with a volt meter I found has no power to it from the second lighted electrical switch . Under the bed where the water heater is mounted there is a plastic conduit coming through the floor that has three separate electrical supply lines inside. One of the three is wired into the metal junction box on the side of the water heater and has no power on it , the other two are not connected and have wire nuts on all the wire ends. When I tested the unused wires to find out if they were hot ,  I found that one has no power and the other is live and is swiched by the water heater wall switch . Seems like LL hooked up the wrong wire ? It is wired on the 30 amp breaker in the power center , my question is if you have the ac element in your water heater is it wired on the 30 amp breaker or one of the 15 amp breakers ?  If I change  the extra switched wire over to the water heater element would  it overload the 30 amp breaker ( I am guessing the ac is on the 30 amp circuit as well ) ? [/p][p]   [span]    [/span][span]    [/span] [/p][p][span]    [/span] Thanks in advance ! [/p][p][span]    [/span][span]    [/span]Len[/p]

[david]

Len:

The following is some general information and some guesses as I have never seriously looked into our unit's AC system:

First I would expect that the wiring that you saw partially connected should be properly wired this way: the hot or black wire to a terminal on the heater designated as such. The other is a neutral(white)and should be wired to a neutral terminal designated as such. The third wire is almost certainly a green or bare safety ground and should be wired to a frame connection on the heater. It is totally shameful, almost criminal that LL didn't wire this right.

Secondly most RV/boat electric water heaters use a 1,500 watt element which can run on a 15 amp circuit. You say that the hot wire is supplied by the main 30 amp breaker? That is also wrong. The 30 amp breaker should have nothing on it other than other breakers. You may find an empty 15 or 20 amp breaker and if so wire the water heater supply wire to that breaker. Otherwise it could be possible to use the 30 amp breaker but the wire to the water heater will have to be 10 gauge for that to work. If you are not sure it is 10 gauge then don't do it. You could overload the wire and burn up your trailer. My guess is the wire is 14 or 12 gauge and must be supplied by a 15 or 20 amp breaker to be safe.

Sounds like whoever wired your trailer didn't know that he was doing.

But in reality you don't need 120V to power the water heater. LPG works fine. I would disconnect the wire at the breaker panel, disconnect it from your water heater and put a wire nut on each wire and forget about AC to the water heater.

David

[charliem]

[font size="3"]A little bit added to David's comment. The Progressive Dynamics 4045 will have up to a maximum of seven 120V circuit breakers installed, depending on what options you have. If you have A/C, Micro, and 120VAC operated water heater your breakers will be:

[ul type="disc"][li]Main, 30 Amp[/li][li]Air Conditioner, 20 Amp
[/li][li]Microwave, 15 Amp[/li][li]Outlets, 15 Amp[/li][li]Converter, 15 Amp
[/li][li]Fridge, 15 Amp
[/li][li]Water Heater, 15 Amp[/li][/ul][p]
[/p][p]Though not necessarily in this order.  The 30 Amp main switches ALL the other breakers. The water heater is powered through the 30 Amp main, 15 Amp WH breaker, Lighted wall switch, and little black toggle switch mounted on the WH itself, in that order. The point is switching any of the these four breakers/switches will turn off the WH. The WH should be wired to its separate 15 breaker, not directly to the main breaker, but the main breaker will interrupt 120V to everything.
[/p][p]
[/p][p]It sounds like your WH is definitely miswired. Find the wire that is switched by the lighted red toggle switch and connect it to the WH. Make sure your WH is full, make sure all four switches mentioned above are on. You should get hot water.
[/p][p]
[/p][p]I know this is a bit wordy, but it's early and I'm still on pain meds from my second knee replacement. So forgive me and let me know if I need to clarify.
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[lanell]

[p] [span]    [/span]Here is a picture , 1000 word type , to show the three wires run under the bed . The long one was hooked up by LL and has no power , the left one is also unpowered . The middle one was unused but is powered by the 15 amp breaker it shows on the power center to be the w/h  . I rewired the water heater using the correct wire and now all is well , took 10 minutes for the water to get warm . Any idea why they run the extra wires ? This is the second thing I have found to be mis-wired on our trailer , the other was the 12 volt charging station which was hooked up to dead wires .I also rewired it after speaking to our dealer. We love our Camplite so much I am not bothered by these small things . What a great camper ![/p][p][span]    [/span]Len [/p][p]
[/p][p][span]    [/span]Thanks for all the help and also hope you recover soon charliem[/p]

[david]

[p]I am not as laid back as you are about this wiring fiasco. It looks like a total mess.[/p][p]
[/p][p]And I am not convinced by your description that it is now wired right or that the two other cables with wire nuts on them are not a ticking bomb. I am also leery of the whole trailer's AC wiring given what I see. I would have an electrician look at it.

David[/p]

[charliem]

[font size="3"]Len,

You're quite welcome and I'm glad it all works. Seems like you got a Friday afternoon unit. Sometimes manufacturers run unneeded wires to allow for additional options, even on different models. For instance they may put bedside outlets on the 16TBS. The wire harnesses are made up ahead of time to accommodate other configurations.

Now that you have that area corrected I would cut off the individual unused black and white wires so that no copper is exposed. Then twist on the wire nuts so that the wires can not be touched or short out to the trailer frame. It's a safety thing.

BTW you can run both gas and electric heating elements at the same time. This will decrease the recovery time. Two vs one cuts recovery time about in half. After you get the tank up to temperature the electric element will maintain it without using any propane.


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[tinkeringtechie]

I'm glad you were able to fix your problem, but I would try and trace those last couple runs before closing this case. Also, just capping the wires is totally unacceptable in my book... they should be in a junction box. I doubt that the water heater junction box is big enough, but high voltage wires should never be loose.