Factory modifications

[gafarmer]

Is the factory accepting modifications on new customer orders? We are considering a 21BHS, but we want twin beds instead of queen bed. Can we get the twin beds with a fold down bunk and no upper cabinets? From reading the forum, I knew you were relocating the factory and understood the factory would possibly be accepting modifications after the move was completed.

Is the factory accepting modification orders currently? If not, when will the factory accept modifications orders? If there is no plan to accept modification orders, please tell me.

Thanks

[christianm]

Hi there! 

Thanks for considering the 21BHS! 


Unfortunately, at this time, we are not offering any modifications here at the factory. Though our move has been completed for some time, our current production system does not allow for any changes in production. 

If that situation at any point changes, we will make it publicly known ASAP! 

Thanks, and let me know if you have any other questions :-) 

Christian 

[aggie79]

That's a shame. For two years we've been saving for a 21RBS but with twin beds instead of a queen bed.

Is it possible to 'delete' the rear bed?  I can build the twin beds myself.

[djsamuel]

I just don't get this.  Thor is sure making some negative changes.  While I bought my 21BHS off the lot, the willingness to work with the buyer was something that really set tme apart.  Now they are getting so much like everybody else.

[charliem]

'[quote source="/post/18138/thread" timestamp="1454085313" author="@aggie79"]That's a shame. For two years we've been saving for a 21RBS but with twin beds instead of a queen bed.

Is it possible to 'delete' the rear bed?  I can build the twin beds myself. [/quote][font size="3"]When you say "'delete' the rear bed" I assume you mean delete the queen so you can build two singles. A beauty of the CL construction is everything is pretty much bolted into/onto the aluminum floor and walls. IIRC someone here did a similar conversion using the parts from the OEM bed or couch. Search this forum. You might also be able to buy the extra side cabinets and bed assemblies from LL since they still sell the 16TBS. A lot of work, but you'll have it your way. Hmmmm....Seems like that used to be a CL advantage... :-[ [/font]

[charliem]

[quote timestamp="1454085600" author="@djsamuel" source="/post/18139/thread"]I just don't get this.  Thor is sure making some negative changes.  While I bought my 21BHS off the lot, the willingness to work with the buyer was something that really set tme apart.  Now they are getting so much like everybody else.[/quote][font size="3"]They seem to be intent on removing all the things that set LL apart. Like you, Doug, I'm rethinking my recommendation speech. I won't recommend against LL, they're not there yet, but my list of pros is getting shorter including the reasons I went with LL. It really does make you wonder why Thor bought LL in the first place  [attachment id="1133" thumbnail="1"][/font]

[david]

I have a 16TBS with twin beds. I wouldn't think twice about ordering it with a Queen, ripping it out and building twins. The OEM mattress is crap anyway. The bed frame is aluminum angle. The beds can be fabricated with a hack saw, locking pliers and a pop rivet gun.

If you are anywhere near DHRV in Apex, NC near Raleigh, talk to Dave there. They are rather brave about doing modifications to factory LLs.

David

[daplumbr]

Well, it does give Thor a way to reduce competition with the other aluminum trailer, which is about twice the price. I think LL is missing a potential for higher profits by not offering custom work (at a price). I know from the history of the 16TBS that the design came from an idea a dealer had and the first ones carried a special engineering fee of $500. LL may also be missing the opportunity to get great ideas into future regular production to make even more desirable campers (read even more profit). Look at the car industry where the base models can optioned out for 10s of $1000s higher price! Can you imagine the profit potential if LL were willing to sit down with a customer, start with a base model, and then option it out with modular packages?

[david]

Well, I think it is a lot different for a new car salesman to sit down with a buyer and tick off the boxes for all of the options that are fully engineered, tested, production certified, with any special parts in the pipeline. For anything custom from LL a LL designer has to communicate with the dealer and buyer, specify what is wanted, do the design installation layout, price it up and then manage it through the one-off production process.

You won't make a lot of money and the potential for error is high.

David

[peislander]

When I ordered my small but mighty Camplite 11FDB in 2012 we negotiated a bunch of factory modifications in addition to the option of the orbit front & off-road package. Modifications included providing an aluminum finish in the interior for the main walls, a Thetford cassette toilet & no black tank, a dual battery tray, the Quickbite coupler, and two thermostatic Fan-tastic Vent fans. In addition to prices applied to each modification the factory charged a $1000 "engineering fee". At first I thought that was exorbitant but as we went through the process I realized it was a bargain that likely didn't cover their true cost. Scott Tuttle and I coordinated with several lengthy emails and a few calls. In order to coordinate the modifications with his team there were several meetings & he reported back on staff concerns, ideas etc. The cad technicians at Livin'Lite had to produce shop drawings to properly communicate to the production people what was needed. All in all they easily blew through that $1000. I was impressed that they cared to take the time to "do it right". I was also not too surprised to hear that they have become more reluctant to do custom work. If I understand it correctly they only produce trailers that are ordered -- and of course everyone wants those orders filled asap. The kind of stuff they did for me interferes with keeping product moving efficiently out the door.

I agree with David that some modifications potential owners might want can be accomplished rather easily. The bed change is a good example of that. Likewise putting chairs in a slide-out instead of the stock couch, as has been talked about recently here, should be easy. 

[mitch]

I truly believe that if the company wanted to do the work they would.  They would charge for it, people would pay for it and they could make it profitable.  This, in my opinion, is the difference between entrepreneurs like Scott Tuttle and big corporations.  Entrepreneurs figure out how to make it work because the care about making it work.   Corporations do things because that's the way they do things.  Yes, the profit motive exists for both and it's entirely a valid motive.  But on balance, the focus of the the two groups is very different because the attitude is very different.