[font size="3" face="comic sans ms"]Hello all,
I thought I would put this thread in the general area since it may relate to several models.
We have a Camplite 14 DBS and love it. Sometime this year as we were camping, one overhead LED light started to flicker on even when it was switched off. And when I would bump the ceiling next to the switch and it would flicker on and off. I immediately suspected aluminum shavings from manufacturing were the culprit.
Since it was still under warranty, I took it to our dealer and they replaced it with another light fixture. In a few weeks, it started again. Being a retired electrical tech, I decided to check out the situation myself and removed the light fixture and found lots of aluminum shavings laying on the fixtures non-insulated connections! I disconnected the battery and then removed the shavings and also vacuumed above the ceiling area around the light fixture wiring access hole. There were lots of shavings laying all around the fixture mounting hole area. When I removed the aluminum shavings , I then insulated the switch connectors with some electrical tape to prevent any lingering shavings from contacting the connectors, before I reinstalled the fixture.
Sooo, if you have a similar light flickering or the switch not functioning properly, it may very well be the shavings left over from the factory above the ceiling shorting the on-off switch. This could be a serious fire hazard, and could burn up your wiring.[/font]
Yeppers... You definitely aren't unique with that issue. I've seen a couple posts on here regarding that exact same problem with the shavings. I guess they are insulating before cutting holes in the roof?
I wouldn't worry too much about causing fires or damaging wiring because those lines are fused. If a line were to short it should just blow the fuse.
We had the same problem with a ceiling light in out 14DBS. After much exhaustive troubleshooting*, it turned out the problem was it needed to go to the dealer for them to take care of under warranty.
* I didn't actually do anything other than flip the switch back and forth a few times before losing interest. It was exhausting.
We've had 3 fixtures short out so that they would not turn off separately. Vacuuming out the aluminum shavings mess fixed it, but in one case the problem returned. Apparently there are shavings roaming around the roof and getting jostled back into the fixtures. So, I just removed all the fixtures and put a small (1X1) circle of thin fiberglas insulation on top of the electrical connections as I reinstalled them. If any more shavings find their way back into fixtures, they can't get on the connections and cause problems. This would be an extremely easy and virtually no-cost modification to the factory installation procedures that would eliminate a common problem. For me, it was an hour well spent because it's a lot easier to do all that with a power screwdriver and shopvac in my driveway than it is at a campground with no power tools and at night when a light won't turn off.
I suspect that I have the same problem, the lights flicker and sometime they even turned on by themself, I will check this next time I go in my trailer, if I unplug my battery can I keep the 120v plugued to use the vacuum? Is the 12v system stop working when battery is unplugued?
Paul, I am pretty sure those 2 systems are independent of each other. Plugged my 16DB in with no battery installed and everything worked.
[quote source="/post/11873/thread" timestamp="1433244920" author="@paul"]I suspect that I have the same problem, the lights flicker and sometime they even turned on by themself, I will check this next time I go in my trailer, if I unplug my battery can I keep the 120v plugued to use the vacuum? Is the 12v system stop working when battery is unplugued?[/quote]Paul,
Flickering lights can come from two sources. One is the aluminum chips and can be corrected by removing the fixture, removing the chips, and replacing the fixture. The chips can cause the light to come on by itself or make it difficult to turn the light off. One member suggested placing some insulation around the switch terminals before reinstalling and I think this is an excellent idea.
The second source of flicker is bad connections in the socket itself. This usually shows up as slight flickering while the light is operating. Not extreme, but annoying. The cure is to remove the small screw holding the LED panel and unplugging the entire LED panel. This is accomplished by a gentle rocking/pulling motion on the LED assembly. Clean the contacts with a cloth moistened with rubbing alcohol or contact cleaner and reinstall the assembly, again with a slight rocking motion. It will help to unplug and reinsert several times.
Disconnecting the battery with the 120V AC still connected is OK. The vacuum will work and the 12v system will also work The converter supplies 12V when the battery is absent.
Thank you Charliem
Here's a photo of the aluminum (with some polystyrene) debris from inside ONE light fixture in the ceiling of my Camplite. This is what gets in the switch and shorts out the circuit so the light either doesn't turn off or flickers. I poured this into a plastic bowl and added a penny for scale. The debris is left from the self-drilling, self tapping installation screws used for the fixtures (8 screws for each one). It's faster for LL to install this way, but it leaves a mess that creates random short circuits as this junk gets jostled around.
(http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j393/Merlin3141/IMG_1452_zpspbdew81t.jpg) (http://s1083.photobucket.com/user/Merlin3141/media/IMG_1452_zpspbdew81t.jpg.html)
Thanks for the aluminum shavings photo. I had this fixed under warranty a few weeks ago, along with several other things. Wondered what it looked like....
[p]Same here, aluminum shavings everywhere.[/p][p]
[/p][p]On my other Trailer, it was Wood chips everywhere![/p]
we have owned ours for going on 3 seasons and i still have to vacuum up aluminum shavings after each trip. they just keep coming out of nowhere
It would be nice if they would clean it up at the factory while doing their work it would be easier I have flickering problem too I will vacuum it up soon
The aluminum shavings mess turned out to be the likely source of our furnace problem too. In a trip report I noted that our furnace was acting odd and seemed to be attempting to start (but not actually starting), even when the thermostat was set to "Off". I could only stop it by pulling the furnace fuse. When I got back I carefully vacuumed the furnace exterior from both the inside and outside access panels. There was lots of aluminum shavings everywhere in that cabinet, including on top of the furnace where circuit boards are. I also used the vacuum as a blower and blew everything out (after vacuuming), in both the inside and outside access points. I realize this was risky (blowing stuff where it shouldn't be), but I figured the risk/benefit was worth it. No problems since and the furnace runs normally.
Most of the lights in my 21 developed the flicker issue during our cross country. Over the course of the trip, I eventually pulled them all and cleaned the shavings out. Easy enough to do and the problem is now fixed.
This past weekend I had to do the same. Lots of metal filings in my 21RBS too. Also did the speakers as well, but that seemed to be styrofoam and not so much the shavings.
Ok- so reading through this thread, I would like to take this to our GM/Head or production. I think that it wouldn't be a difficult fix (just some clean up!) and it would save YOUR time and effort and OUR warranty dollars (rofl)
SO, would I simply need to tell him that the aluminum drill shavings are causing wiring/lighting malfunctions? Or does it bear a more technical explanation. Let me know what you guys think!
In general, those metal filings seem to be all over the place. I am still cleaning them out of the cabinets.
[quote source="/post/14361/thread" timestamp="1440003873" author="@gibby"]In general, those metal filings seem to be all over the place. I am still cleaning them out of the cabinets.[/quote]This. They need to spend 20 minutes with a shopvac cleaning out all the cavities of foam and aluminum. I've found other bits (wire loom, connectors, pieces of conduit) inside closed areas. Those would have to be removed by hand, but the person creating that mess just needs to be more aware.
[quote source="/post/14359/thread" timestamp="1439999599" author="@christianm"]Ok- so reading through this thread, I would like to take this to our GM/Head or production. I think that it wouldn't be a difficult fix (just some clean up!) and it would save YOUR time and effort and OUR warranty dollars (rofl)
SO, would I simply need to tell him that the aluminum drill shavings are causing wiring/lighting malfunctions? Or does it bear a more technical explanation. Let me know what you guys think! [/quote]This seems to be a step missed on some trailers, not all, Christian. I have experienced shavings in only one light diffuser and have had all my fixtures apart to check for this.
Quote from: @ammobob" timestamp="1433245943" source="/post/11875/threadPaul, I am pretty sure those 2 systems are independent of each other. Plugged my 16DB in with no battery installed and everything worked.
Hello all,
I was just scanning the website and looked at one of my earlier posts and saw this quote from Ammobob above.
IT IS NOT A GOOD IDEA TO POWER UP THE 120 VOLT AC WITHOUT A BATTERY CONNECTED TO THE 12 VOLT SYSTEM. THE BATTERY CHARGER SYSTEM WILL PUT OUT A HIGHER VOLTAGE THAT COULD DAMAGE THE ELECTRONIC CIRCUITS IN YOUR TRAILER.
MAKE SURE YOU HAVE THAT BATTERY INSTALLED TO BE SAFE. I THINK I READ THIS IN THE OWNERS MANUAL OR THE CHARGING SYSTEM MANUAL.
Been having a great camping year in our 14DBS and loving it!!!!!
Happy camping,
Shortcircuit
[quote source="/post/14579/thread" timestamp="1440547484" author="@shortcircuit"][quote source="/post/11875/thread" timestamp="1433245943" author="@ammobob"]Paul, I am pretty sure those 2 systems are independent of each other. Plugged my 16DB in with no battery installed and everything worked.[/quote]Hello all,
I was just scanning the website and looked at one of my earlier posts and saw this quote from Ammobob above.
IT IS NOT A GOOD IDEA TO POWER UP THE 120 VOLT AC WITHOUT A BATTERY CONNECTED TO THE 12 VOLT SYSTEM. THE BATTERY CHARGER SYSTEM WILL PUT OUT A HIGHER VOLTAGE THAT COULD DAMAGE THE ELECTRONIC CIRCUITS IN YOUR TRAILER.
MAKE SURE YOU HAVE THAT BATTERY INSTALLED TO BE SAFE. I THINK I READ THIS IN THE OWNERS MANUAL OR THE CHARGING SYSTEM MANUAL.
Been having a great camping year in our 14DBS and loving it!!!!!
Happy camping,
Shortcircuit[/quote]Fortunately the post was about lights so when I said everything worked on shore power with no battery I was talking about the lights. Only had it plugged into 15 amp 110 V. Sorry if what I said was misleading shortcircuit.
Quote from: @christianm" source="/post/14359/thread" timestamp="1439999599Ok- so reading through this thread, I would like to take this to our GM/Head or production. I think that it wouldn't be a difficult fix (just some clean up!) and it would save YOUR time and effort and OUR warranty dollars (rofl)
SO, would I simply need to tell him that the aluminum drill shavings are causing wiring/lighting malfunctions? Or does it bear a more technical explanation. Let me know what you guys think!
I know for a fact that LL is aware of this issue. When I was talking to Don about my warranty registration right after we bought our 21, he brought this to my attention as an "oh by the way" - just to keep in mind should the lights ever start flickering. And they did.
It was this thread that I remembered when mine started to do it. It is so nice to know exactly what the problem is, and what to do to fix it. Makes life simple.
[p][font face="arial"]I experience the same in the fixture above the table on my 21 RBS 2016; I can just not figure how to remove it; can someone help ?[/font][/p][p][font face="Arial"]
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[font size="3"]Push up and slide the clear lenses away from the switch. They are a bit stubborn, but they will come off. Inside there are four screws on each side. Remove them and the fixture will come free.
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[p]Thank you Charlie, simple but not knowing I could have easily break it.[/p][p]I will eventually post my experience (bad) upon delivery of my unit [/p]
Karen and I are camping at Big Ridge State Park, north of Knoxville, and guess what?
Our kitchen light just flickered!
First experience with this - will report back on what I find.
Mine have been flickering on and off, (2015 Campsite 21RBS) I'll check for shavings, but I'm not surprised, I took out the furnace to fix a gas leak and the compartment was loaded with debris, not a little , ALOT, shavings, plugs from where the hole saws were used and styrofoam. Virtually every compartment had aluminum shavings and styrofoam, how hard could it be to vacuum the units out during assembly?
[quote source="/post/14705/thread" timestamp="1440938269" author="@monigeb"][p]Thank you Charlie, simple but not knowing I could have easily break it.[/p][p]I will eventually post my experience (bad) upon delivery of my unit [/p][/quote]Oh man! Sorry to hear that your delivery experience wasn't good. :-(
Without knowing the situation, I'm not sure if this does any good...
But please let me know if there is a way I can help you on behalf of Livin Lite. Feel free to private message me any time!
I know I'm kind of late to the party on this thread, but perhaps others like myself search these forums for solutions, and might find this tip to be helpful.
All our lights flickered badly from day one after we took delivery of our 14DB in Feb 2015. We complained to our dealer who attempted to resolve the problem by vacuuming out aluminum shavings from the light fixtures. The situation seemed to improve but did not go away entirely. So I tried squirting contact cleaner (CAIG DeoxIT D5S-6 Spray) into each of the switches, including the wall switches. This seemed to resolve the problem entirely. So apparently there is an issue with oxidation of some of the light switch contacts. Coupled with the aluminum shavings, the contact oxidation can make the flickering lights very tricky to resolve.
[quote timestamp="1464312228" source="/post/21574/thread" author="@tarheelcamper"]I know I'm kind of late to the party on this thread, but perhaps others like myself search these forums for solutions, and might find this tip to be helpful.
All our lights flickered badly from day one after we took delivery of our 14DB in Feb 2015. We complained to our dealer who attempted to resolve the problem by vacuuming out aluminum shavings from the light fixtures. The situation seemed to improve but did not go away entirely. So I tried squirting contact cleaner (CAIG DeoxIT D5S-6 Spray) into each of the switches, including the wall switches. This seemed to resolve the problem entirely. So apparently there is an issue with oxidation of some of the light switch contacts. Coupled with the aluminum shavings, the contact oxidation can make the flickering lights very tricky to resolve.[/quote]Thanks tarheelcamper. The contact cleaner is a good idea. I see amazon has a >> [a href="http://www.amazon.com/DeoxIT%C2%AE-DN5-Mini-Spray-nonflammable-solution/dp/B000RGD9PK/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1464340909&sr=8-3&keywords=CAIG+DeoxIT+D5S-6+Spray"]minispray version[/a] << as well as >> [a href="http://www.amazon.com/Hosa-D5S-6-DeoxIT-Contact-Cleaner/dp/B00006LVEU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1464340909&sr=8-1&keywords=CAIG+DeoxIT+D5S-6+Spray"]the product you likely used[/a] <<.