4th of July...what's the big deal?

[kath]

Gee.  I didn't believe it was possible to feel bad on a day like today. But I think you guys have managed it. Think I'll take a break for awhile.

[whoofit]

[quote source="/post/12723/thread" timestamp="1435380333" author="@gwbushhog"]Since it's just us now, will lob one....but just for you, Whoofit.  Here goes:  Should activists that have been trying to put hard-working mom-and-pop bakers and pizza makers out of business be more concerned about what's happening here? ( http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/isis-executioners-kill-gays-by-hurling-them-off-roofs-mosul-1482198)



Since this thread is first and foremost about America's independence from tyranny 239 years ago, I'll conclude with Benjamin Franklin's sobering words:

[font size="5"]"We must all hang together, or most assuredly we shall all hang separately."
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Alright, duck.....................BOOM!  

    




[/quote][p]UH!...MEDIC!!

Here is what I think, GW.

Pink, Black, Green, Red, White or Blue...and in any combination. As a business person the money is all the same color and flavor to me. I will never discriminate while my shingle is hanging performing services and earning money from any legal citizen or legal immigrant in my neck of the woods. I believe it does a disservice to my business as I am an equal opportunity Capitalist.

I do believe that those who are not so friendly to those that are of a variety different in some legal way than themselves kind of need to get over themselves. I can see the problem if the gay couple wants the cake baked in the Nunnery or blessed by the Pope himself (if one is so inclined as to consider the Pope as Christs representative on Earth). But I do not see the legal standing for someone to refuse service on infringement of civil rights grounds....no sir/maam.

If the business was ONLY baking cakes to supply ONLY Christian weddings....then, it's AOKAY! If the business was only sending these cakes Storkmail directly to Heaven packed in Dry Ice....then it's AOKAY!!

Now, here's where the triage might come into play.....  (zzz) I do think the fight by all persons against discrimination against all legal persons on these shores is a noble cause.  BUT there must also be an exit strategy to now remove those groups of people from the Protected Class designation. This one is a biggie with me.

Does that make me biased? I would like someone to prove that it does![/p][p]
[/p][p]On radical Islam, I have already offered my opinion on them in more ways than one. ISIS would easily fall into that category if I was given half a chance.
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[whoofit]

[quote source="/post/12726/thread" timestamp="1435386724" author="@kath"]Gee.  I didn't believe it was possible to feel bad on a day like today. But I think you guys have managed it. Think I'll take a break for awhile. [/quote][p]Since I am only one of two persons that could have brought you to this juncture, I would like to know what words or actions I have spoken or done to make you feel this way, Kath?[/p][p]
[/p][p]The quote you posted made me feel a touch better. They were words of inspiration.[/p][p]
[/p][p]I am sorry if my truthfully spoken words, my belief set or my mannerism in some way has led you to this decision. As you know first hand, by initiating this line of conversation (not to mention your lifetime struggle), it takes some backbone to have an intelligent adult discussion about "What's next for our Nation". What's next is TBD but surely you can see how one SCOTUS decision has implications for the next?[/p][p]
[/p][p]Anyways, I think you already know this first hand, don't let some words drive you from your comfort zone. If I was you I wouldn't. If I was me I can assure you that I wouldn't!.... [/p][p]
[/p][p]Got to add that, unless you could explain to me the reason why you feel this way, with me being one of two members of "you guys", and if I had thinner skin, I might feel just a tad bit offended by your statement that I quoted above, Kath. But that would ultimately be my problem to deal with. I guess it would be like me being happy to be able to retire then on retirement day be sad to be of that age?
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[kath]

I think it was the references to incest and the pictures of gay men being thrown off the roof that did me in.

I try to be kind in this life and always hope for the same back. If we are not here on earth for that, then what is the point?

I think we're just in different worlds, after all.  Thick skin is not always a good thing to have.

[whoofit]

[quote source="/post/12730/thread" timestamp="1435421425" author="@kath"]I think it was the references to incest and the pictures of gay men being thrown off the roof that did me in.

I try to be kind in this life and always hope for the same back. If we are not here on earth for that, then what is the point?

I think we're just in different worlds, after all.  Thick skin is not always a good thing to have. [/quote][p]Well if the execution of gay men in this fashion bothers you as it bothers me then we both should know, skin thick or thin, what side our bread is buttered on. Because that is [strong]Holy War[/strong] we are talking about. Something this country just doesn't seem to have the gonads to face up to.[/p][p]
[/p][p]But the largest growing population in this nation does subscribe to its tenets and several groups are working in concert to reduce the numbers of those who feel duty bound to fight that evil where ever it may rear it's ugly head...foregoing any personal feelings of sexual orientation and how that relates to their religious beliefs.[/p][p]
[/p][p]So, I kinda get your point of feeling disheartened, Kath. It's just that you are celebratory right now and rightfully so but, like I said in my initial response to you in this thread, marriage equality is a huge deal to you but doesn't even begin to scratch the surface. [/p][p]
[/p][p]And I won't pressure any one to explain how the [strong]rights[/strong] of [strong]consensual[/strong] adult [strong]citizens[/strong] in [strong]love[/strong] of the same sex persuasion should be[strong] trampled[/strong] just because they have the same mothers, for instance. It is hard to make the argument about how that law cannot be changed when the most recent one was.... Unless one chooses to become an [strong]oppressor[/strong] that is?[/p][p]
[/p][p]So there you have it. Radical Islam is one of the items on my "mile long list"... [/p][p]
[/p][p]And P.S. we are not in different worlds. At the present we share this one.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Really glad to see you back! I really do mean that ..[/p][p]
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[whoofit]

[whoofit]

"CNN reported in recent weeks that U.S. law enforcement officials believe the Islamist terrorist threat is the highest in years. The officials have raised concern about possible domestic attacks tied to the July 4 holiday and the upcoming visit of Pope Francis."

http://www.wcvb.com/politics/authorities-warn-of-possible-terrorist-threats/33795908?utm_campaign=WCVB&utm_content=558e154104d3016977000002&utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=trueAnthem%3A+Trending+Content
 

[jeeps]

[font size="3"]The 4th of July is a big deal to me and it has been my goal for the past several years to reread and ponder the Declaration of Independence on this day.  So thank you for the reminder.  

I am deeply saddened about the direction our beloved country is going and disagree with the recent rulings of the Supreme Court. That said, I strongly believe that everyone, regardless of their opinions and lifestyles, deserves to treated kindly, respectfully, and fairly.  Discrimination in jobs, housing, etc., is wrong.  That's the person I was taught to be by my Christian faith.

At the same time, that respect must go both ways and I, as one who will always believe in traditional marriage as it has been defined in all major societies throughout history, hope to receive the same respect.  And if we ever cross paths in a campground, may we sit around the campfire as friends sharing marshmallows.   [/font]

[silly122]

A Canadian point of view heading to July 4th (Our day).

IsIS - need to look deeper in to the cause and stop trying to fight the symptoms. Remember, this fight has been going on in the area since Alexander the great. I think once the root cause is better understood, steps can be taken to mitigate the blow back of US and allies working in the area.

Same sex marriage - I too used to have an issue with the use of the word and not so much with the act itself. I'm not religious, but always felt the word was the right of the religious. I've since changed my mind on it as I get older. Also, benefits aren't as big a problem up here since we have social care. As long as the Conservatives don't F it up for us, I hope to continue to benefit from it for many many years.

Incest - if allowing Incest for only gay people because they won't pre create would be discrimination just in the opposite direction. We need to define our societal rules to work for everyone. Some rules aren't liked by everyone, but some are for the greater good as long as it's not dictated to us by an imaginary being who may or may not exist.

Religion - its very important to many and serves a purpose. Keep religion a personal choice and keep it out of politics and governments.

In closing, treat everyone how you want to be treated an don't condemn or react out of ignorance.

And in case anyone is wondering...
Straight
Male
Married
In my 40s
Kids
And just trying to be a good human being and would prefer governments stop spying unless there is a just cause and not because I typed ISIS in a forum once.

Enjoys your holiday our southerly brothers and sisters.

Posted using my powerful BlackBerry Z30 and probably from my 21BHS

[whoofit]

[quote source="/post/12736/thread" timestamp="1435450566" author="@poncherelly"]A Canadian point of view heading to July 4th (Our day).


Incest - if allowing Incest for only gay people because they won't pre create would be [strong]discrimination just in the opposite direction[/strong]. We need to define our societal rules to work for everyone.


[/quote][p]Will not offer my opinion of this one way or another only to say that I did not choose to attempt to marry my sister or brother.[/p][p]
[/p][p]I would like to say that incest in itself is NOT illegal in about half of the USA. Though incest marriage is not allowed because of genetic implications at least. If not morality reasons too.[/p][p]
[/p][p]But here in the USA reverse discrimination does not apply just so you know. There is no such thing.
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[silly122]

[quote source="/post/12736/thread" timestamp="1435450566" author="@poncherelly"]A Canadian point of view heading to July 4th (Our day).


Incest - if allowing Incest for only gay people because they won't pre create would be [strong]discrimination just in the opposite direction[/strong]. We need to define our societal rules to work for everyone.

[p]Will not offer my opinion of this one way or another only to say that I did not choose to attempt to marry my sister or brother.[/p][p]
[/p][p]I would like to say that incest in itself is NOT illegal in about half of the USA. Though incest marriage is not allowed because of genetic implications at least. If not morality reasons too.[/p][p]
[/p][p]But here in the USA reverse discrimination does not apply just so you know. There is no such thing.
[/p][/quote]
Ya my point wasn't to argue incest one way or the other but rather to point out there are reasons for some rules but as long as everyone treats each other right, don't force your beliefs on anyone and don't do anything to harm anyone else, we'll all do well.

This has gone so far beyond camping at this point however lol have a good night everyone.

Posted using my powerful BlackBerry Z30 and probably from my 21BHS

[kath]

[quote source="/post/12734/thread" timestamp="1435438721" author="@brenda"][font size="3"]I am deeply saddened about the direction our beloved country is going and disagree with the recent rulings of the Supreme Court.
[/font][/quote]@brenda, I want to make sure I understand what you're saying. Do you believe that my family should not have the same protections under the law that your family enjoys?

[charliem]

[font size="3"]Please take this to a more appropriate forum.  Thanks
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[whoofit]

[quote source="/post/12743/thread" timestamp="1435494173" author="@charliem"][font size="3"]Please take this to a more appropriate forum.  Thanks
[/font][/quote][p]Charlie, but this area is the proper place for such discussions per the description in the header. I have seen no personal attacks or vulgar and obscene comments.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Now, the last post and reply by Kath to Brenda is beginning a new line. It is asking someone to justify their belief set. That is a dangerous direction. In my opinion no one should be compelled to justify their position.  Otherwise, this is the "Anything....." forum.[/p][p]
[/p][p]I for one enjoy the frank and candid discussion. I am proud that things have not gotten out of hand.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Five more days till those HOTDOGS!! I don't count today cuz we are having hotdogs today too...
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[charliem]

[font size="3"]Whoofit,

I think we agree on all points. But if you don't take cover when storm clouds first appear you'll soon get very wet. Hence my post. BTW, when I said more appropriate forum I did not mean just another section of this forum. I meant a different forum entirely. 

What time will the 'dogs ready??
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