Hello everyone. I just purchased a used 16DB and it has the fold down stabilizers. I am looking at replacing them with scissor jacks. Has anyone done this?
Have not done this mod, but want to replace the original stabilizers with scissor jacks. Two out of four of my stabilizers do not work properly, pin them for now (keep them from slipping) until replacement with scissor jacks.
[a href="http://s657.photobucket.com/user/vstromklr/media/2013/2014/IMG_5564_zps37b25440.jpg.html"]
(http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu299/vstromklr/2013/2014/IMG_5564_zps37b25440.jpg)
(http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu299/vstromklr/2013/2014/IMG_5563_zps93e72683.jpg)
From a technical perspective it shouldnt be difficult. Just remember that even if you replace them with scissor jacks, you shouldnt actually jack up the trailer with them. The attachment points are designed for stabilizing, not leveling. If you put too much stress into the frame with the scissors you could end up twisting or warping it and causing damage in the long run.
If you keep that in mind I'd say go for it and let us know how it goes :)
-Sean
[quote source="/post/5479/thread" timestamp="1418226325" author="@exploringcarolina"]Have not done this mod, but want to replace the original stabilizers with scissor jacks. Two out of four of my stabilizers do not work properly, pin them for now (keep them from slipping) until replacement with scissor jacks.
[a href="http://s657.photobucket.com/user/vstromklr/media/2013/2014/IMG_5564_zps37b25440.jpg.html"]
(http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu299/vstromklr/2013/2014/IMG_5564_zps37b25440.jpg)
(http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu299/vstromklr/2013/2014/IMG_5563_zps93e72683.jpg)
[quote source="/post/5486/thread" timestamp="1418241279" author="@admin"]From a technical perspective it shouldnt be difficult. Just remember that even if you replace them with scissor jacks, you shouldnt actually jack up the trailer with them. The attachment points are designed for stabilizing, not leveling. If you put too much stress into the frame with the scissors you could end up twisting or warping it and causing damage in the long run.
If you keep that in mind I'd say go for it and let us know how it goes :)
-Sean[/quote]
Definitely good points to remember. If I do put scissor jacks I'll make sure not to put too much stress on the frame. The problem I think I'm going to run into though is that the mounting tube that LL put into place for the fold-down stabilizers is right near the corner and if I put the scissor jack there it will stick out pretty far. I don't know if I want that.
This might be a job for the service department.
Quote from: @shonsu" timestamp="1418252815" source="/post/5493/thread[quote source="/post/5486/thread" timestamp="1418241279" author="@admin"]From a technical perspective it shouldnt be difficult. Just remember that even if you replace them with scissor jacks, you shouldnt actually jack up the trailer with them. The attachment points are designed for stabilizing, not leveling. If you put too much stress into the frame with the scissors you could end up twisting or warping it and causing damage in the long run.
If you keep that in mind I'd say go for it and let us know how it goes :)
-Sean
Definitely good points to remember. If I do put scissor jacks I'll make sure not to put too much stress on the frame. The problem I think I'm going to run into though is that the mounting tube that LL put into place for the fold-down stabilizers is right near the corner and if I put the scissor jack there it will stick out pretty far. I don't know if I want that.
[/quote][font color="#000000"]The sticking out part has always been my concern also. Unless I'm looking at it wrong, if I use the same mounting holes when fully retracted the scissors jack will be perpendicular to the long orientation of the trailer. It'd probably stick out at least four to six inches, maybe more.[/font]
[quote source="/post/5501/thread" timestamp="1418302331" author="@mitch"][quote source="/post/5493/thread" timestamp="1418252815" author="@shonsu"]Definitely good points to remember. If I do put scissor jacks I'll make sure not to put too much stress on the frame. The problem I think I'm going to run into though is that the mounting tube that LL put into place for the fold-down stabilizers is right near the corner and if I put the scissor jack there it will stick out pretty far. I don't know if I want that.
[/quote][font color="#000000"]The sticking out part has always been my concern also. Unless I'm looking at it wrong, if I use the same mounting holes when fully retracted the scissors jack will be perpendicular to the long orientation of the trailer. It'd probably stick out at least four to six inches, maybe more.[/font][/quote]That's been my reason for not switching to scissors jacks. They'll either stick out the sides or back of the trailer, depending on how they are mounted. I have an idea that they can be mounted further under the trailer someplace, where they'll be far enough to the outside edges so that they stabilize, but no so far as to stick out. Custom bracketry would be required though
[quote source="/post/5503/thread" timestamp="1418306355" author="@michael"][quote source="/post/5501/thread" timestamp="1418302331" author="@mitch"][font color="#000000"]The sticking out part has always been my concern also. Unless I'm looking at it wrong, if I use the same mounting holes when fully retracted the scissors jack will be perpendicular to the long orientation of the trailer. It'd probably stick out at least four to six inches, maybe more.[/font][/quote]That's been my reason for not switching to scissors jacks. They'll either stick out the sides or back of the trailer, depending on how they are mounted. I have an idea that they can be mounted further under the trailer someplace, where they'll be far enough to the outside edges so that they stabilize, but no so far as to stick out. Custom bracketry would be required though
[/quote]
That's what I'm thinking too. I'm going to have to look around for a shop that does aluminum welding.
[quote source="/post/5492/thread" timestamp="1418252628" author="@shonsu"][quote source="/post/5479/thread" author="@exploringcarolina" timestamp="1418226325"]Have not done this mod, but want to replace the original stabilizers with scissor jacks. Two out of four of my stabilizers do not work properly, pin them for now (keep them from slipping) until replacement with scissor jacks.
I have the same problem with one of them. The spring that keeps tension on the locking mechanism is missing so it does not lock in place. I'm going to try the clevis pin like you did. Was the 2" length long enough?
The 2" pin is installed completely in the above photos. Have been using 7/16"X2" pins over a year and installing scissor stabilizers are not a priority mod at this time for me. While using the rod to snug the stabilizer pad on the ground, I install the pin above the rod and ease the stabilizer down on the pin. Installing the pin could be a pinch point, so care must be used. Reverse the pin installation for pin removal. EC
[/quote][/quote]
On a related note...
I'm aware that the stabilizing scissor jacks are not meant for leveling.
But...
On our recent camping trip to Chilhowee, the trailer was just off from level laterally by a tiny amount.
I just set the stabilizers with a little more authority on the "low" side. It was enough to nudge the ball back to the exact center.
Seemed safe enough. Anyone else ever try that?
With the drop leg jacks you really don't have much choice but to do that. There isn't any ability to fine tune from one hole to the next in the jack so if I want the camper to be stable I have to go to the next hole. It almost never works out any other way.
We have the same issues with the drop leg jacks on our 13QBB. We add (4) Camco Aluminum Stack Jacks in the general location of each of the dljs. We also add blocking to both the dlj and the Camco jacks to minimize the play associated with the jacks being extended. Yes it does add time to setting up, but it does make for a much more stable QBB. They stack for storage. It takes some trial and error to synchronize with adjacent dlj. We set up with the dljs first, then add the Camco jacks to the main structures a few feet away from the dljs. Raise each Camco jack just enough so as not to loosen the dlj nearby. It works for now until we find a better solution.
http://www.amazon.com/Camco-44560-Olympian-Aluminum-Stack/dp/B000760FWU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1418336970&sr=8-1&keywords=camco+jacks
Quote from: @fasteddieb" source="/post/5511/thread" timestamp="1418322542On a related note...
I'm aware that the stabilizing scissor jacks are not meant for leveling.
But...
On our recent camping trip to Chilhowee, the trailer was just off from level laterally by a tiny amount.
I just set the stabilizers with a little more authority on the "low" side. It was enough to nudge the ball back to the exact center.
Seemed safe enough. Anyone else ever try that?
Desperate times call for desperate measures. I had an experience with my Quicksilver where the site was so unlevel I had not choice except to use my stabilizers to level the unit. I essentially had the low side nearly off the ground for the night. I'm not saying it was smart, nor would I recommend doing it long term, but I will say from experience that these units can take a good bit of stress. I have not seen and negative effects from it to this point. I'm not sure how well that translate to any of the CL's though since I assume any flex or twisting has a more dramatic effect.
I think manufacturers will often keep their written guidelines well below normal tolerances as a way to CYA. I also think users/owners will often go well above intended tolerances either out of ignorance, necessity, or accepted risk. Ultimately only personal experience will tell you exactly what you can and cant do.
I think you're more likely to get away with it in a smaller unit where the rig weight is less, and the spans are shorter.
Just returned from a camping trip. After giving more thought about replacing stabilizers, will replace the originals with same type of stabilizers probably from e-trailer. Currently have two bad stabilizers.
When we get into a campground late, camp one night, leave early the next morning, these stabilizers are easy to set up & knock down when in a hurry. They can be purchased for less than $20 each, so will stay with this style and keep the 7/16"X2" pins in case one or more does not work properly.
Will measure to see if e-trailer stabilizers fit using existing mount:
http://www.etrailer.com/dept-pg-Trailer_Jack-sf-Stabilizer_Jack.aspx
Quote from: @pinstriper" source="/post/5525/thread" timestamp="1418486111I think you're more likely to get away with it in a smaller unit where the rig weight is less, and the spans are shorter.
I wasnt as worried about the trailer itself, but rather I wasnt sure how much the stress the jacks could actually take. Turns out they can take a lot more than I expected.
Ordered stabilizers from e-trailer today, not going with scissor style jacks. Their listed dimensions are the same as original equipment.
http://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Jack/Atwood/AT82301.html
I installed BAL C type stabilizer jacks on my 13 QBB and love them. Way easier to use and I think more effective than the swing down type. I installed the front fore/ aft and the rears inboard/outboard with connecting channel option offered by BAL. Easy to do with a little drilling. I should note I have the off road package with 14 inch wheels so the swing down stabilizers were the long type and never seemed very solid.
The C type provide more clearance when stowed and don't require special measures when in uneven terrain. No additional brackets or structure was required.
If anyone wants pix of the installation let me know.
those drop legs are terrible. used them one trip and replaced them with scissor jacks (~$75 for a pair from camping world). i used the same mounting location, which is a square piece of aluminum tube welded to the underside of the camper. the replacement jacks came with opposing "L" shaped brackets, which can be replaced with flat steel (or even bent flat if you want to go that route). either way, drill 4 holes hrough the sides of the original mounting points that line up with the brackets for the scizzaor jacks and run bolts through the brackets and mounting location. the new scissor jacks were wider than the aluminum tube they were being mounted to, so i had to use a washer on each side as a spacer. mine do stick out past the edge of the trailer a bit when all the way up, but they have never been in the way and it is a small price to pay to get rid of those flip down legs
original front jacks...
(http://i350.photobucket.com/albums/q439/mushr00min/DSC01099crop_zps0e0u7bq7.jpg)
[img style="" style="max-width:75%;" src="http://i350.photobucket.com/albums/q439/mushr00min/20141231_151242_zps1znskvv4.jpg"]
Never had an issue with the flippers till last weekend. Like them actually. Quick, light and stable for us. The problem was an unlevel site that forced me to break out the trenching tool and dig down a couple inches to deploy. Maybe scissors some day but not today.
Had them on our 2013 16DB and used them for 2 years with no real issues. Adjustability was lacking but they worked. Think the scissors would give you a bit more stability.