We have never towed anything and have zero experience in that regard. According to the specs on the LivinLite website the 21RBS has a dry weight of 3350 and a load capacity of 1650 meaning, I suppose, a total weight of 5000 pounds. Could this be safely towed by a GMC Canyon with a stated Max Conventional Trailering of 7000 pounds? Is that enough of a safety margin? Should I instead be looking at a full size pickup?
That would be a fine tow vehicle, but you will want to do some learning and practice trailering before hauling that long/heavy a trailer if you've never done any towing before.
On top of whatever reading and online videos, consider spending a couple weekends renting flatbed/box trailers in increasing lengths from your nearby rental center. Should be in the neighborhood of $50-75 for a day, then find empty parking lots (schools or fairgrounds or community colleges etc.) where you can do some practice backing up and learning what the trailer really does in forward and backwards.
You will learn good skills and confidence.
I personally learned a lot about trailering with a cart behind the riding lawnmower.
[quote timestamp="1443537994" author="@pinstriper" source="/post/15614/thread"]
I personally learned a lot about trailering with a cart behind the riding lawnmower.
[/quote][p]Yes, I totally agree! If I recall correctly you posted this a while back. Was it was this box trailer and lawnmower or am I mistaken? [/p][p]
[/p][p]
(http://i1312.photobucket.com/albums/t521/minuteman1965/Donkey-Pulling-Cart-random-2758106-508-366_zps3nir0qkp.jpg)
[quote timestamp="1443537342" source="/post/15613/thread" author="@stephen99"]We have never towed anything and have zero experience in that regard. According to the specs on the LivinLite website the 21RBS has a dry weight of 3350 and a load capacity of 1650 meaning, I suppose, a total weight of 5000 pounds. Could this be safely towed by a GMC Canyon with a stated Max Conventional Trailering of 7000 pounds? Is that enough of a safety margin? Should I instead be looking at a full size pickup?[/quote][font size="3"]Here's my experience for your consideration. I tow a 2014 21RBS with a 2103 Toyota Tacoma 4X4 short bed double cab 4.0L with a supercharger, rated at 6400# towing weight. This is very similar to your 21RBS/ Canyon depending on your engine.
First, some reality: The LL website is somewhat out of date and conservative. The "empty" weight with options is closer to 3500#. The axles and stock tires are rated at 7000# so the GVWR should be 7000#. If you get the off road package the supplied BF Goodrich AT tires are rated slightly lower, but still close to 7000#. With camping gear and empty waste tanks you can plan on 4500# total weight and 500-600 lbs on the tongue.
You didn't say what truck configuration you are looking at or where you plan to tow. From the 7000# rating I'll assume the 3.6L engine. [/font][font size="3"]One problem I notice is that GMC/Chevy rates the 3.6L horsepower at 6800 RPM. I just can't get used to a engine screaming like that.
[/font][font size="3"]The 7000# rating on the Canyon means the frame and brakes will handle the trailer. You should be fine from that regard. The 3.6L engine is a bit light, but should be OK in most instances. Climbing hills and high altitudes may be marginal, but it just means slow down. I would recommend 4WD and make sure you have the towing package including an external transmission oil cooler. You will also need a Weight Distribution Hitch (WDH), but that's easy.
I tow a lot at altitude so I added the TRD belt driven supercharger. It's probably not needed at lower elevations, but without a V8 I wanted it. Some results of a recent trip are at [a href="http://livinlite.proboards.com/thread/1549/tacoma-towing-21rbs?page=1&scrollTo=15602"]http://livinlite-owners.com/thread/1549/tacoma-towing-21rbs?page=1&scrollTo=15602[/a]
I hope this helps your decision.
[/font]
[quote source="/post/15614/thread" timestamp="1443537994" author="@pinstriper"]That would be a fine tow vehicle, but you will want to do some learning and practice trailering before hauling that long/heavy a trailer if you've never done any towing before.
On top of whatever reading and online videos, consider spending a couple weekends renting flatbed/box trailers in increasing lengths from your nearby rental center. Should be in the neighborhood of $50-75 for a day, then find empty parking lots (schools or fairgrounds or community colleges etc.) where you can do some practice backing up and learning what the trailer really does in forward and backwards.
You will learn good skills and confidence.
I personally learned a lot about trailering with a cart behind the riding lawnmower.
[/quote]Thanks for the tip on renting varying length trailers in order to practice. Sounds like an excellent idea. I keep trying to picture it in my mind. What happens to the trailer when I turn the wheel to the left (or right)? I think I understand it and just need some actual practice.
[quote source="/post/15619/thread" timestamp="1443542372" author="@charliem"][quote source="/post/15613/thread" timestamp="1443537342" author="@stephen99"]We have never towed anything and have zero experience in that regard. According to the specs on the LivinLite website the 21RBS has a dry weight of 3350 and a load capacity of 1650 meaning, I suppose, a total weight of 5000 pounds. Could this be safely towed by a GMC Canyon with a stated Max Conventional Trailering of 7000 pounds? Is that enough of a safety margin? Should I instead be looking at a full size pickup?[/quote][font size="3"]Here's my experience for your consideration. I tow a 2014 21RBS with a 2103 Toyota Tacoma 4X4 short bed double cab 4.0L with a supercharger, rated at 6400# towing weight. This is very similar to your 21RBS/ Canyon depending on your engine.
First, some reality: The LL website is somewhat out of date and conservative. The "empty" weight with options is closer to 3500#. The axles and stock tires are rated at 7000# so the GVWR should be 7000#. If you get the off road package the supplied BF Goodrich AT tires are rated slightly lower, but still close to 7000#. With camping gear and empty waste tanks you can plan on 4500# total weight and 500-600 lbs on the tongue.
You didn't say what truck configuration you are looking at or where you plan to tow. From the 7000# rating I'll assume the 3.6L engine. [/font][font size="3"]One problem I notice is that GMC/Chevy rates the 3.6L horsepower at 6800 RPM. I just can't get used to a engine screaming like that.
[/font][font size="3"]The 7000# rating on the Canyon means the frame and brakes will handle the trailer. You should be fine from that regard. The 3.6L engine is a bit light, but should be OK in most instances. Climbing hills and high altitudes may be marginal, but it just means slow down. I would recommend 4WD and make sure you have the towing package including an external transmission oil cooler. You will also need a Weight Distribution Hitch (WDH), but that's easy.
I tow a lot at altitude so I added the TRD belt driven supercharger. It's probably not needed at lower elevations, but without a V8 I wanted it. Some results of a recent trip are at [a href="http://livinlite.proboards.com/thread/1549/tacoma-towing-21rbs?page=1&scrollTo=15602"]http://livinlite.proboards.com/thread/1549/tacoma-towing-21rbs?page=1&scrollTo=15602[/a]
I hope this helps your decision.
[/font][/quote]Thanks for the info. I haven't purchased a tow vehicle yet and am open to all suggestions. Based on a friend's recommendation I took a look at the Canyon and liked what I saw but I am open to all possibilities. You mentioned using a WDH. That's a whole other area I have no knowledge of. Hitches and how to use them. Still lots to learn.
[quote source="/post/15621/thread" timestamp="1443545537" author="@stephen99"]Thanks for the info. I haven't purchased a tow vehicle yet and am open to all suggestions. Based on a friend's recommendation I took a look at the Canyon and liked what I saw but I am open to all possibilities. You mentioned using a WDH. That's a whole other area I have no knowledge of. Hitches and how to use them. Still lots to learn.
[/quote][font size="3"]Yes, lots to learn. We all had to do it. Lots of friendly helpful people here. Stick with us :)
GMC/Chevy is reintroducing the Canyon/Colorado to try and recapture part of the mid sized truck market. My personal preference from a purely towing perspective would be an F-150 1/2 ton PU, but the truck size and difficulty of access to the box without a step stool turned us toward the Tacoma. I owned the previous generation Tacoma and loved it. So we traded up to the 2013 Taco. Take a look at the Tacoma
[/font]
Since you have not purchased your TV yet you might consider a full size truck with a V8. Then you would have no problems towing the 21RBS anywhere you wanted. I tow a 21BHS behind a RAM 1500 and it barely knows it's back there. Of course the sacrifice is gas mileage as a daily driver so lots to consider. Good luck with your final decision.
My .02 cents (currently valued at .01335 due to inflation and currency conversion) go with a full size unless it's just to expensive. You can't have to much tow vehicle only to little. Certainly the Tacoma will do the job and I expect the Canyon would be fine also but the bigger truck will have an easier time. A Ford with an Ecoboost engine will get about the same mpg as a Tacoma.
(Disclaimer, I just switched from a 2013 Tacoma to a 2015 Ford F-150)
Just an FYI ........Toyota discontinued the supercharger for the Tacoma this past July. Charliem is one one the fortunate ones to have one!
[quote source="/post/15626/thread" timestamp="1443550721" author="@nd1979"]Just an FYI ........Toyota discontinued the supercharger for the Tacoma this past July. Charliem is one one the fortunate ones to have one![/quote][font size="3"]Correct. Toyota will no longer sell or warranty the S/C, but I believe is still fits the 2014 Taco and maybe more. You could buy the S/C from an aftermarket supplier as I did, at a great savings. According to my Toyota shop mechanic there were no changes to the 2014 engine that would preclude the S/C installation. I think Toyota got tired of hassling with EPA regs, same as the diesel issue. [/font]
[quote source="/post/15625/thread" timestamp="1443550370" author="@mitch"]My .02 cents (currently valued at .01335 due to inflation and currency conversion) go with a full size unless it's just to expensive. You can't have to much tow vehicle only to little. Certainly the Tacoma will do the job and I expect the Canyon would be fine also but the bigger truck will have an easier time. A Ford with an Ecoboost engine will get about the same mpg as a Tacoma.
(Disclaimer, I just switched from a 2013 Tacoma to a 2015 Ford F-150) [/quote][font size="3"]I agree that, from a pure towing standpoint, the full sized PU is better. Mitch can certainly beat me up a hill, but there were other size considerations for us. In fact, with that F150, Mitch doesn't even have to tow his 13QBB. He can just load it in the back and drive off ;)[/font]
Quote from: @whoofit" source="/post/15615/thread" timestamp="1443538680[quote source="/post/15614/thread" timestamp="1443537994" author="@pinstriper"]I personally learned a lot about trailering with a cart behind the riding lawnmower.
[p]Yes, I totally agree! If I recall correctly you posted this a while back. Was it was this box trailer and lawnmower or am I mistaken? [/p][p]
[/p][p]
(http://i1312.photobucket.com/albums/t521/minuteman1965/Donkey-Pulling-Cart-random-2758106-508-366_zps3nir0qkp.jpg)That's what Genius looks like when it happens.
Quote from: @charliem" source="/post/15619/thread" timestamp="1443542372[quote source="/post/15613/thread" timestamp="1443537342" author="@stephen99"]We have never towed anything and have zero experience in that regard. According to the specs on the LivinLite website the 21RBS has a dry weight of 3350 and a load capacity of 1650 meaning, I suppose, a total weight of 5000 pounds. Could this be safely towed by a GMC Canyon with a stated Max Conventional Trailering of 7000 pounds? Is that enough of a safety margin? Should I instead be looking at a full size pickup?
[font size="3"]Here's my experience for your consideration. I tow a 2014 21RBS with a 2103 Toyota Tacoma 4X4 short bed double cab 4.0L with a supercharger, rated at 6400# towing weight. This is very similar to your 21RBS/ Canyon depending on your engine.
First, some reality: The LL website is somewhat out of date and conservative. The "empty" weight with options is closer to 3500#. The axles and stock tires are rated at 7000# so the GVWR should be 7000#. If you get the off road package the supplied BF Goodrich AT tires are rated slightly lower, but still close to 7000#. With camping gear and empty waste tanks you can plan on 4500# total weight and 500-600 lbs on the tongue.
You didn't say what truck configuration you are looking at or where you plan to tow. From the 7000# rating I'll assume the 3.6L engine. [/font][font size="3"]One problem I notice is that GMC/Chevy rates the 3.6L horsepower at 6800 RPM. I just can't get used to a engine screaming like that.
[/font][font size="3"]The 7000# rating on the Canyon means the frame and brakes will handle the trailer. You should be fine from that regard. The 3.6L engine is a bit light, but should be OK in most instances. Climbing hills and high altitudes may be marginal, but it just means slow down. I would recommend 4WD and make sure you have the towing package including an external transmission oil cooler. You will also need a Weight Distribution Hitch (WDH), but that's easy.
I tow a lot at altitude so I added the TRD belt driven supercharger. It's probably not needed at lower elevations, but without a V8 I wanted it. Some results of a recent trip are at [a href="http://livinlite.proboards.com/thread/1549/tacoma-towing-21rbs?page=1&scrollTo=15602"]http://livinlite.proboards.com/thread/1549/tacoma-towing-21rbs?page=1&scrollTo=15602[/a]
I hope this helps your decision.
[/font][/quote]
The axles and tires might be up to 7000# but the aluminum frame and the coupler probably have something to say in the matter. The weakest link wins.
Read the fine print and you'll find that just about all hp ratings are taken in an rpm range you would never run. Sometimes you can find a power curve graph that tells you more about what power is really available. Torque curves are even better.
I endorse everything else Charlie says, but would say a Taco is a little light in curb weight and short/narrow for my comfort with a longer trailer. A Tundra would be a better choice and probably solves the bed height mentioned on the F-150.
TANSTATMTV
[quote source="/post/15632/thread" timestamp="1443555744" author="@pinstriper"]
The axles and tires might be up to 7000# but the aluminum frame and the coupler probably have something to say in the matter. [font color="f9093f" size="3"]Frame is probably OK. Coupler we already know about.[/font]
A Tundra would be a better choice and probably solves the bed height mentioned on the F-150. [font color="f9093f" size="3"]Nope. Ford/Chev/Toyota/Dodge have all gone to high sided boxes. You need a step stool to reach the center of the box unless you're 6'14".[/font]
[/quote]
Charlie is on the mark about box side height, I just figure when the bullets fly it gives me better cover and concealment.
Quote from: @mitch" source="/post/15634/thread" timestamp="1443563799Charlie is on the mark about box side height, I just figure when the bullets fly it gives me better cover and concealment.
Salesman proceeded to tell me that the new Aluminum bodies would stop a 50cal. I asked him if that was with or without a slingshot.
Take into consideration where you will be towing as you choose a tow rig. Someone who tows a 6000 lb trailer up and down the east coast at sea level will not have the same torque/horsepower requirements as someone who tows in Colorado or Utah.
x 2 on the full size, although the new canyon/colorado diesel might be something to look at. Big point, as mentioned above, is not so much the weight in this case, but the combination of weight and the front cross section area of the trailer. In any type of headwind, the trailer will punish the truck...even with a full size. The engine torque is what matters here. The canyon/colorado base V6 might be screaming throughout out the trip if the winds are bad, and for me..that just makes the travel seem somewhat longer than an easy drive in overdrive with a V8... (I used to have an S10 ZR2 and the lesser weight of the truck to anchor the trailer down in the wind was notable). For the 21 CL I would think a V8 would last longer and be less prone to extreme towing pressures of a high revving engine.
But I've since downsized to a 13 er maybe a few of the 21ers will have a bit more value added input. Price point on the silverado and sierra line up is comparable to the canon and colorado...with no requirement to mess with aftermarket installs...The new GM full sizes even come with integrated trailer brakes...