[p]Sean's recent post about running out of space for pictures did not have a quick comment box at the bottom. Here is a link to that thread- [a href="http://livinlite.proboards.com/thread/1125/pictures-attachments"]http://livinlite.proboards.com/thread/1125/pictures-attachments[/a]. Maybe the subforum that he posted under doesn't allow comments, although he did ask for them. So I have started this thread to discuss the quality of the forum, its costs and what to do about it. If your original thread can be made to accept comments, please merge this post with that forum Sean.[/p][p]
[/p][p]First a few words site's performance- nothing about content. It is a unique BBS, the only one that I monitor that uses this SW. It is also the slowest that I monitor.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Next about content. This is a really great resource for LL owners. I liken it to an Island Packet boating forum that I belong to. IPs are cult boats just like LLs and everyone on both forums speaks almost passionately about their boat/camper. Also there is essentially no acrimony as is sometimes found on more general sites.[/p][p]
[/p][p]The point of the foregoing is- we need to keep it going somehow.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Sean's suggestion to use Flickr, etc is awful. I don't want to have to first upload a picture to another site, copy the URL and paste it into my LL post. I want to upload directly to this site. Frankly I will stop posting pictures if we can't figure another way.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Is the problem perhaps file size? Many BBS forums limit the size of the file that you can upload to less than 100K which is perfectly adequate for almost everything. With a fast internet connection and cameras that create big files, I can easily see people uploading 5 Mb files.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Finally costs. I am amazed that with membership over 500 and soon to hit 1,000 that two banner ads top and bottom can't support this forum with reasonable picture attachments. Other BBSs that I belong to use the vBulletin SW, have a banner ad at the top of each page, have a membership count of about 1,000 and run faster. These seem to survive ok and have an extensive picture uploading capability, but they do limit file size.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Another forum, the Island Packet forum, is run by a passionate IP owner and SW geek. He uses an antiquated BBS system that he has patched and patched but it works very well. He covers the hosting himself. I don't know what it costs. I am not volunteering to do this myself as I haven't a clue how to do it.[/p][p]
[/p][p]So those are my thoughts. Perhaps Sean could comment about speed, file size limits and cost. Others chime in with your thoughts.[/p][p]
[/p][p]David[/p][p]
[/p]
[p]As many of you are aware, I ended up purchasing a camper that was not a LL, but made a number of friends here so I continue to post from time to time. The forum I use for my Trailmanor ([a href="http://www.trailmanorowners.com"]www.trailmanorowners.com[/a]) charges those of us who want to read all about how to maintain and mod our trailers $12.00 per year. They have it professionally hosted, we can post as many pictures as we want, and they use vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 as their software platform. To do this, they structured the content so that it easily allows people to use the free areas and "hides" the pay areas for those that have not subscribed. New members are allowed 30 days to have full access so they can see the value of the restricted areas. [/p][p]
[/p][p]I am not suggesting that you want to copy what they did, but just noting that it works. We have some very talented electricians, solar experts, battery experts, along with a number of just comfortable trailer owners that all contribute and no one questions the value of the areas that require a subscription. Just some info on what one other forum has been doing for at least 15 years.[/p][p]
[/p][p]
[/p][p]
[/p]
This forum was started because the old Yahoo forum was/is horrible. pro boards is a huge improvement, and it's free except for the time Sean and admins put in to managing it. So many folks use Flikr, Google, photobug, etc that I think it's reasonable to use that to link pictures. I don't mind ads, but I think charging users is a mistake. Hard core folks won't hesitate to pay a few bucks a year, but it will discourage new owners and potential new owners. My $0.02.
Without getting into all hosting solutions I think $12 a year is a small price to pay for the information one gains from the wealth of knowledge on this forum. I owned a 16 DB for 2 years and had no clue of some of the issues I faced that were already addressed in this forum. I have a 21BHS on order this forum has given me so much insite into what to expect or look for when I go to pick it up it's worth more then $12. Suggested mods are worth more than that in itself. I am in and let's keep it going.
$12 per year is OK by me, too
1. David's comment about performance - are you sure it isn't the ads themselves that are slowing the page loads ? A lot of crappy scripting out there slowing down the interwebs something fierce.
2. I think the ad revenue doesn't go to Sean or anyone but Proboards. Maybe there's another tier where the ad revenue goes to support the board ? Maybe we don't have enough members or pageviews ? Sean, what can you share about this ?
3. I use a number of other forums that have similar photo restrictions with much more activity and many more members. I agree it sucks, but it's not an egregious fault, endemic to this forum. Quite common, actually. Did I say that I agree that it sucks ? So far I have proven too lazy to go through the extra hoops, not to mention I need another account on another web service like I need another pair of ears. My solution is to just not post pictures, and it's been working out great for me, so far.
4. I don't think the LL community is large enough or geeky enough to feel compelled to paying membership, and charging will only stifle membership growth, in my view.
5. The thought occurs to hit LL up for the costs, or at least a share. They get a lot of stroke from this forum, I think. Maybe. I dunno. We can just tell them they do, and they write the check. Worth a shot, IMO.
6. The current ad showing for me is Jimmy Dean brand sausages. A quality, American product. I for one will do my part to support them. Jimmy Dean. Sausage. 'merica.
7. I lost my train of thought and forget what I was going to say, but I do recall it was pretty insightful and impressive in its insights.
8. If I'm going to be asked to pay, people are going to have to start making better quality posts. Step it up people ! The folks I'm talking about know who they are.
I don't mind paying a dollar a month for this board, but someone who is at the point where they are just surfing for information probably would not pay. I think Livin Lite should be approached.
I am not on many other boards - the Good Sam board, irv2 at the present. Are there other alternative boards where we could move?
[quote source="/post/11250/thread" author="@pinstriper" timestamp="1432348999"]
7. I lost my train of thought and forget what I was going to say, but I do recall it was pretty insightful and impressive in its insights.
[font color="#c22e11"]8. If I'm going to be asked to pay, people are going to have to start making better quality posts. Step it up people ! The folks I'm talking about know who they are.[/font]
[/quote]
[font size="4" color="#0b0b0c" face="comic sans ms"]Are you talking about my posts, PinStriper? You are, aren't you? Darn, I knew it! (zzz)
Well, if we're asked to pay $12, does this mean we also get you as arbiter of 'quality posts'? Now that's a deal![/font]
Some days, I come to this forum just to read pinstriper.
[p]Guess my post created some interesting follow-up postings. I remind everyone that I noted that all new members to the Trailmanor forum have FULL access to all areas for a period of time. Only after that time period, and if they choose to, do they pay the yearly fee (which does not have to be $12.00 if you do not want that amount). Nothing stops someone from signing back up on a forum with a new user name to get the full free access if that is what they want to do. In your case, you may want a two or three month free period, that is up to you if you want to charge anything at all. General chat about camping, Trailmanor models, Prospective Owners questions, and other general discussion topics are in the free section that requires no subscription to be paid. [/p][p]
[/p][p]I do caution you about one thing. If LivinLite becomes the underwriter of this forum, its independence may be questioned by those that become interested in LL products in the future. Just the nature of the beast. [/p][p]
[/p][p]FYI: Here is what new members are told about becoming a sponsor on the Trailmanor forums. The post has not been updated since Sept 2002 so it seems to have worked well for them:[/p][p]
[/p][p]Welcome to the TrailManor Owner's page.
Our site has moved to a Sponsorship system to help cover the costs of hosting. Here is how it works:
You don't have to register at all. You can browse our guest areas for free. You won't be able to post.
If you register as a new user (it's free), you will have complete access to the board, the same access as a Site Sponsor, for 30 days.
At the end of the 30 days, if you haven't become a Site Sponsor, you will be dropped to Registered Guest status. You will have access to all guest areas, and will be able to post in those areas as well. But you will lose access to the Sponsor areas.
If you choose to become a Site Sponsor, you have access to all areas of the board for a full year. The cost to become a site sponsor is $12 payable by Check or via PayPal
[/p]
[quote source="/post/11250/thread" timestamp="1432348999" author="@pinstriper"]
5. The thought occurs to hit LL up for the costs, or at least a share. They get a lot of stroke from this forum, I think. Maybe. I dunno. We can just tell them they do, and they write the check. Worth a shot, IMO.
[/quote]
As I remember it, Scott Tuttle offered early in establishing this forum for LL to cover costs. Sean would remember better than I do, but I think we wanted it to be completely independent. We all worship at the altar of LL, but it's still good to be independent. I have mixed thoughts, however. I would rather keep it free for anyone to join and have LL cover any costs than to try and cover costs ourselves and deter (even a little) any member growth.
From time-to-time I have recommended >> [a href="http://postimage.org/"]Postimage.org[/a] << as a free & easy way to post images to the board. I just visited there and see they offer a solution for forums like this.
Their image upload can be embedded in proboard forums ---- users would not need any other services & not need to visit another site when they want to upload. Users do not need to register (so no possibility of spam) or log-in. They do the resizings needed so users can upload multi-mb images if they want without any need to previously downsample. In a posting a user could add as many images as they want. Postimage.org would host the images for free and they don't purge images for inactivity. There servers seem quite fast. They also don't claim copyrights on images -- they are simply hosts. As hosts of the image files the bandwidth required for the forum drops significantly.
Here is the page Sean would go to to add the file-hosting service to this proboard.
>> [a href="http://postimage.org/mod.php"]http://postimage.org/mod.php[/a] <<
[quote source="/post/11272/thread" timestamp="1432390512" author="@peislander"]From time-to-time I have recommended >> [a href="http://postimage.org/"]Postimage.org[/a] << as a free & easy way to post images to the board. I just visited there and see they offer a solution for forums like this.
Their image upload can be embedded in proboard forums ---- users would not need any other services & not need to visit another site when they want to upload. Users do not need to register (so no possibility of spam) or log-in. They do the resizings needed so users can upload multi-mb images if they want without any need to previously downsample. In a posting a user could add as many images as they want. Postimage.org would host the images for free and they don't purge images for inactivity. There servers seem quite fast. They also don't claim copyrights on images -- they are simply hosts. As hosts of the image files the bandwidth required for the forum drops significantly.
Here is the page Sean would go to to add the file-hosting service to this proboard.
>> [a href="http://postimage.org/mod.php"]http://postimage.org/mod.php[/a] <<[/quote]PEI,
I went to the Postimage web page via your link and probed around a lot. This seems to be an excellent solution to our problem. They already list Proboards as a SW option so they must already be in use by existing Proboard forums. I walked through their user instructions and it does appear the setup is a one time effort by Sean. Each forum user just clicks a button, selects the image in his/her computer, selects desired size, and clicks on upload. Simple. No third party URLs, no Photobucket/Flickr accounts, nothing. If I understand this correctly the member interface would be very similar to our present attachment interface. So, in the words of our Senator Fred Thompson in a running TV ad. "There's got to be a catch?" How does Postimage make their money?
Thanks for bringing this to our attention. I'll add my recommendation that Sean take a look.
[quote timestamp="1432384505" author="@subaruwx" source="/post/11267/thread"]Some days, I come to this forum just to read pinstriper. [/quote][p]That's pitiful. You need to get out more.[/p][p]
[/p]
i am on a handful of other forums and have always found a tiered membership is acceptable to most people. to keep new people coming around (nothing more frustrating than having to became a member when you are just our searching for information), generate income, and reduce the load on the resources required for the forum they could do something like this...
level 1 - access to all of the posted information (no membership required)
level 2 - access to all of the posted information and ability to post, pictures must be linked, limited number of saved private messages (free membership required, basically what we all have now)
level 3 - access to all of the posted information, ability to post, ability to upload pictures to the board, additional number of saved private messages (fee-based membership required, lower cost)
level 4 - access to all of the posted information, ability to post, ability to upload pictures to the board, unlimited number of saved private messages, ability to disable ads (fee-based membership required, higher cost)
this way the more capabilities you feel you need from the board is tied to the amount you pay. new people find it as a free resource and as their membership requirements grow, they can pay to do more.
an example...
joe what-is-an-ll-camper-anyways is considering a shiny new camper and wants to research the ll brand. he does a web search and finds this forum. he can read all of the informative (well, mostly informative lol) posts without even creating an account (level 1). since he doesnt even have to register, we don't scare him off to search for easier-to-access information. now joe is intrigued by what he sees and wants to ask questions, so he can create a free account (level 2) and ask all the questions he wants. at this point he is now joe-maybe-wants-to-be-an-ll-owner. with level 2 being free he isnt scared off by having to pay $$ to get answers. being such a wonderful community we accept him into the all-aluminum clan and share our wealth of knowledge with him. he can even post up pics (linked of course) and send some messages to gather more information. joe likes what he sees/hears/finds (we got him hooked now and he cant take his eyes off the shiny all aluminum goodness...joe is even drooling a bit when ever he sees his reflection in a soda can) and decides to buy an ll camper (and if we scare him off he hasnt invested any money and wont come looking for us).
so now joe i-am-now-an-ll-owner wants to modify his new toy and share his experiences (he is a full fledged alumin-ite now). he can continue on with the current membership or is he wants the added features, such as uploading directly to the site, he can up his membership and pay a small fee. by this time he is invested in the site and brand and would probably be willing to "chip in"
after awhile joe has become the most hardcore ll owner imaginable. everyone knows him as joe i-am-THE-ll-owner-and-will-lead-you-all-with-my-aluminum-embrace (most of us call him pinstriper ;) ), and we cant live without his advice. joe is all but living out of his camper full time, travelling across the world, promoting the goodness that is all aluminum, and brainwashing everyone he meets. at this point we are all worshiping ll campers and joe is for all intensive purposes our leader. joe can then up his membership to level 4 to ensure we can all reach him and he can effectively lead us.
my thoughts..nothing else
I'm happy to pay a few $$ a year for a great forum and ability to post photos
I also follow a handful of forums, including the Trailmanor site, and the best ones have tiered access. One of the best, IMHO, is the Pentax Forums (www.pentaxforums.com), also a tiered system and well worth the few bucks I pay. They offer various ways to increase your personal photo storage. Some of the ways involve a little more money and some don't (as in participation strategies). Another is a boating community (www.c-brats.com), whose photos have helped me with technical problems again and again.
I have a Flickr account but hate that extra step. 10, 12, or 15 $$ a year would be worth it not to have to go through that damnable process.
The 30-day free access found on other sites seems to work great. You get some time to check it out and, if it meets your needs, you pay a few $$ to join. You can barely buy lunch for that kind of money.
Finally, I find any forum to be less useful without photos. Especially for mods and other technical help.
I belong to many other type of forums and None require a paid membership.
But, they do accept donations from Members, either by paypal or mail-in-check.
Some even offer a once life-time donation and it isn't much at $35.
All the donations they receive go back into the forum, to help with maintaining the site or other upgrades.
Photo's are limited in size to 640x480 max if using the sites attachment bar, no size limit if you link the Photo.
No guest are allowed to post, you must be a Member.
I like Sushi.
[quote source="/post/11308/thread" timestamp="1432460074" author="@whoofit"]I like Sushi.[/quote]Huh? Is this one those 'quality posts' Pintripper was referring to? Keep it 'shellfish', WF! (rofl)
[p]I enjoy this site enough to join for a modest fee if needed. I have learned enough here to justify some spending.
Not really bothered by using Photobucket and the like but can see how some would be. I've seen what happens to sites when businesses wrangle control. Everything get heavily moderated to a point of sterility. Any conversation about mistakes made by the company get squished hard and fast. Some may want this but I don't. Just like I don't want to only see high praises of the product. Who learns anything that way?
I also would not like to see a tiered membership. I guess if the main mission of the forum was to sell and support Livin'Lite products it wouldn't be so bad but that's not how I interpret Seans mission statement in the other thread. Not really a sales/support site where people are coming for expert answers but a social network where they come to be part of a group of peers.
So, a membership for free or for fee. This is the definition of donation. Problem is donations are not long term sustainable. Plus there are plenty of folks gladly willing to let others always pay their way for them. This is more and more evident in our society lately.
For me, I'll continue to use Photobucket unless the forum finds a better solution. If a donation button appears I will use it to pay my way. If a corporate entity gains control I'll probably fade away.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Cloud storage sites rock, really. How else do you get your photos linked when using Android 100 miles away from your home PC? Usually you will want to reuse those pictures in the future anyways... I have several accounts on the web.
[/p]
Would it be helpful to know how much money in total that we need? Is it hundreds of $ or thousands of $$?
This forum is simply incredible. As a source of ideas, support for problem solutions, networking among members, and entertainment (you know who you are), this forum is the best I've used on the Internet. And the photos are worth the proverbial 1000 words. I think the basic use (reading and posting text) needs to be free for those starting out. Pay sites can be a real block to new members. I'm up for learning how to use external hosting for photos. I already spend time on attachments I post to get them to as small a file size as possible. Useable photos need not be more than around 50KB. Much more than that is a waste of 1's and 0's on a forum. The Land Cruiser forum I belong to (IH8MUD) has a voluntary pay scheme that seems to work for supporting that site, along with lots of vendors who find it valuable to support the fanaticism found on that forum. One concern I have is that if this site establishes user-pay, and if there is still a limit on the overall site storage (albeit larger), we'll eventually hit that too? All in all, Sean and the mods deserve a round of applause for the admin work and keeping us in line and I'll do what they think best for site support. My bottom line is to attempt to keep this forum free to users by making it as easy as possible to use external hosting of attachments, by using sale of banner ads to a very well targeted demographic "delivered" to their business, and by offering a voluntary donation option.
I don't think there is any need to charge anyone for the forum since it pays for itself through the ads that proboards puts on each page. I think that the image issue can be solved just by using a plugin that posts the images to a free service instead of using the proboard "attachments". I just sent one possible plugin to Sean and hopefully we can try it out to see if it might solve the issue. If that doesn't fix it then I think LL should foot the bill since this forum is essentially free advertising and customer support for them.
No problem kicking in some money to keep the wheels turning, and make improvements. I see this site as a wealth of information well worth a few bucks.
[quote source="/post/11394/thread" timestamp="1432645742" author="@tinkeringtechie"]I don't think there is any need to charge anyone for the forum since it pays for itself through the ads that proboards puts on each page. I think that the image issue can be solved just by using a plugin that posts the images to a free service instead of using the proboard "attachments". I just sent one possible plugin to Sean and hopefully we can try it out to see if it might solve the issue. If that doesn't fix it then I think LL should foot the bill since this forum is essentially free advertising and customer support for them.[/quote]TT,
I agree. I sent Sean a note on postimage.org that PEIslander found. Reading their info and your post suggests that postimage.org is also a simple plugin to PB. I guess you're saying there may be others. Don't know how these guys make their money; maybe advertising. From their web site it looks like the user interface (us owners) would be very similar to PB's attachment process. Problem solved.
On value to LL, I like to think we are more than an advertising or customer support function. We are a huge customer feedback asset. Yes we find and solve problems, but we also represent what the customer base wants, either standard or optional. IOW, product improvement ideas. I think, from the evolution we've seen, they really are reading this forum. As for LL paying for the forum, I agree it would be nice, but any hint of company influence/control will kill our authenticity. There's a general perception that company supported sites censor complaints. I think Scott T. understands this, but I'd rather not even get close to an appearance. Let's hope the plugin thing works.
[quote source="/post/11401/thread" timestamp="1432648763" author="@charliem"]On value to LL, I like to think we are more than an advertising or customer support function. We are a huge customer feedback asset. Yes we find and solve problems, but we also represent what the customer base wants, either standard or optional. IOW, product improvement ideas. I think, from the evolution we've seen, they really are reading this forum. As for LL paying for the forum, I agree it would be nice, but any hint of company influence/control will kill our authenticity. There's a general perception that company supported sites censor complaints. I think Scott T. understands this, but I'd rather not even get close to an appearance. Let's hope the plugin thing works.
[/quote]
I agree on both points (feedback and independence). If the existing plugin doesn't work I can create one that meets our specific needs. I'm not sure when I'd be able to get to it though... I've got a pretty busy summer.
I think I may have been a bit unclear in my original post so I want to take a moment to clear things up.
1. I NEVER plan to make this site a paid for site as a whole. IF there is ever an option for a paid subscription it will purely be to support the board on a voluntary basis and it may include an additional section/board for members only. Honestly we dont have to have a true subscription at all. I could add a "Supporting Member" tag and open up the ability to donate to the forum. Then anyone that choses to donate can at least be recognized for their contribution if they desire. Then we can maintain any upgrades as long as there is money in the account.
2. Currently the ads on this site are added by ProBoards and zero revenu comes to me. This is a necessary evil since we have their "free" forum.
3. Our free forum came with 200Mb of storage, honestly I thought we would have run out of space far sooner than we did.
4. ProBoards offers "Upgrades" a la carte. So if we as a group decide we don't want ads, then we can do that, but it's going to cost about $6 per month. If we want to increase our internal storage we can do that as well. ProBoards offers options that range from 500Mb per month which costs $3, on up to 10Gb per month at $73.50. I have no interest in making money on this site so I have no problem being entirely open about any of the options. My personal opinion is that ProBoards overcharges for their storage costs and that even if we limit attachments to a relatively small size its still going to be easy to eat up a large amount of space. Keep in mind that the middle of the road plan for 1200Mb is $9 and 1600Mb is $12.60. If we limited every attachment to .5 - 1 Mb we still could eat up 1200Mb fairly quickly. Then, lets say we upgraded the storage, what happens if/when the money dries up. Modestly we could have a $12 - $15 dollar average monthly cost between removing ads and upgrading storage and that isnt a lot of money over a year. However once it starts, it would be hard to stop. If we stop the increased storage, then our posted content goes away. There is no ideal solution.
5. Scott has in the past stated that he supports our efforts and would be happy to add some financial support. However, I don't know how that would work logistically, nor have I received replies to the last few emails sent to him. I assume he is quite busy and it is easy to overlook an email but as it stands I haven't heard anything about any actual support at this time. As time allows I may reach out again.
6. There may be other options such as the suggestion for using postimage.org as a plugin service. I havent had time to do much more than skim their site, however they have next to no privacy policy or terms of use posted. In my experience this is a red flag. I personally want to know exactly who retains ownership of my content and how its stored/used. In this internet culture we give up so much for "free" services that its just part of doing business, but I for one want to know exactly what I'm giving up. If people want the postimage plugin added I'm sure I can make that happen, but please know who you are working with prior to giving up your content.
7. This all boils down to want vs need and our desire for convenience. I know how I'm going to manage my personal content so I'm happy to try and implement other options for the community as my time allows.
Update...postimage.org "Add image to post" button has been enabled if users want to try it out.
Just uploaded this image via the new postimage button in my post under Camplite Trailers. Simple, quick, easy. No signup. I like it. I agree with Sean that their documentation is very skimpy, so who knows where these photos are going and who owns them, etc. I sent them an email asking a few questions of that nature. For now, posting photos of my CL for technical purposes, I guess I don't care where they go. Anything else, I'll be more wary.
PS: I also like that, when you click on the photo you get a larger version. Good for clarity.
[a href="http://postimg.org/image/dyv7lv03b/"]
[img style="max-width:100%;" src="http://s23.postimg.org/dyv7lv03b/image.jpg"][/a]
Ooooh, I LIKE this new tool. Click on the image to enlarge and scroll down!! Now, what was the subject again?.... ;)
[quote timestamp="1432650580" author="@admin" source="/post/11407/thread"]Update...postimage.org "Add image to post" button has been enabled if users want to try it out.[/quote]Thanks!
Charliem -- With postimage.org you do have the option to register with them. Then if you are logged in & post via their site or with their screen capture application, they will keep track of all the images you've uploaded. I doubt that feature would work using the postimage upload that Sean has added to the forums. Where the logging in thing really works is for website owners or bloggers who might find it desirable to be able to use a free image hosting service and yet be able to update an image directly without editing all the pages that use that image. It is a way of keeping track of the images you've posted. I hesitated to mention the feature here because I have seen other forums effectively sabotaged by former participants who out of spite delete all their former image uploads. That behavior can render old threads useless. Together we are building a resource for our future selves & future owners of Livin' Lite RVs. It would be a shame if users selfishly deleted their old postings just because they no longer wish to participate.
I know some people really get possessive about their images. Frankly I haven't seen any images posted in this forum that warrants paranoid concern that somebody else might copy & use their image. I can't think of a single image posted here that might have a commercial value. It is a legitimate concern for professional photographers who make their living from their images. I think many others get worked up about nothing. I also think most of us realize if we are concerned that our images might be misappropriated, we know we can abstain from posting images.
@PEIslander I agree that most images posted to this site will not have value outside of this community but it still should be something considered. Essentially its just a matter of informed consent. We all give away a ton of information everyday without blinking an eye, so I see no problem with posting a few pictures to a nearly anonymous source so long as we know thats whats happening. I would treat the postimage service just like I'm giving something away. I have no expectation to actually control any aspect of the content after I upload.
(http://s10.postimg.org/vsmwdqkz9/20150502_113044.jpg)
(http://postimg.org/image/vsmwdqkz9/)
I am trying to add a picture of Daisy sleeping in the grass at our campsite on our inaugural RV trip together to see how this system works.
Okay, I like this system for pics! I am anologue in this digital world. No facebok, no flickr, and I am not a twit, there will be no twitter account for me. I don't have time for all of that stuff. But this new system is great!
Quote from: @leslie" timestamp="1432660121" source="/post/11434/threadOkay, I like this system for pics! I am anologue in this digital world. No facebok, no flickr, and I am not a twit, there will be no twitter account for me. I don't have time for all of that stuff. But this new system is great!
Isn't this the truth! Not that we can't, nor haven't, but have learned life is too short. Excepting LL Owners' Forum, of course....'cuz you're worth it.
Looks like postimage.org started showing its true intent with Leslie's post http://livinlite.proboards.com/thread/1146/first-trip-solo-towing-camplite
It looks like it adds extra content in an effort to spam users. I'm taking it down for now. I dont want our members hit with some malicious malware or other junk. On top of that I wouldnt want to see this forum filled with the typical junk spam.
[font size="3"]Sean et al,
I support cutting the postimage plugin. I don't see any popups in any of Leslie's posts, but I have blockers and three layers of spam protection on my computer. Even so I don't dare click on the Suzy pix. I do see the added picture of whatever. Too bad because it was working so well. TinkeringTechie sent you a recommendation too. Was it the same one or another? Surely there are other sites that perform the function with a higher grade of sponsors. Have you found any forums for forum administrators? Image upload/storage is a common problem so it must be under discussion somewhere.
On a related subject I don't really get too excited about ownership of images. If someone wants to repost my new sink or where I carry my sewer hose that's OK. Credit would be nice, but it really doesn't work in today's internet world. Even if someone wanted to use such pix in advertising for their $$ gain, I probably won't get too excited. I doub't someone will make much dough from a schematic of the CL21 water system. That said, I completely understand those who would object to seeing their family camping pictures spread across the world. But this is today's internet world. If you don't want it out there, don't post it. Other than a completely private server (like Hilary C.) you can't control it.
In the meantime thanks for your efforts on behalf of LL users. This this is so good there has to be an acceptable solution. Hollar if I can help.
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I just posted this to the Posting Pictures thread. I am now of the opinion that third party picture sharing sites like Flickr where you upload your picture there (at any size) and just post a link to this forum is the best way to resolve our file storage limitation problem.
"A picture posted directly to this site is rendered at 640x480x24bits no matter what the original uploaded file size is. A 100 Kb compressed jpeg file will render to essentially the same picture quality as a gazillion Mb uploaded file. So uploading a big picture file wastes bandwidth and storage capacity.
Cameras can be set to store their pictures in smaller files, but most can't go down to 100 Kb. I use a freeware program Irfanview (pc based) to resize my pictures before I upload. Just set the new size parameters to 640x480 and you will get about a 100K file when you save it. Go to irvanview.com and download it.
But I will admit that that bit of work is worse than simply saving the gazillion bit file to a Flickr account and posting the link. So I may do that contrary to what I said in the thread that started this discussion. Linking to an outside picture storage service seems to be a reasonable solution to our file storage problem."
David
Using sites like flickr and photobucket also allow embedding the pictures so there is no need for a direct link. They provide the BBCode which is rendered in a post seamlessly. Example of a picture from my Table Rock album on Flickr:
(https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7651/16357973113_90023698e7_h.jpg)
(https://flic.kr/p/qVuTvc)P1000110 (https://flic.kr/p/qVuTvc) by Sean_NC Camper (https://www.flickr.com/photos/52403555@N05/), on Flickr
In the end I dont want to collect money if its avoidable so I'm thinking we are going to be forced into third party host sites like photobucket and flickr. Most other forums already do this in some way and its the simplest option in the long run.
See this, which I just posted elsewhere:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8677/15984474182_604b42dc1e_o.jpg)What at I do is copy and paste the BBCode link, then delete everything except the blue highlighted text above.
Flickr tutorial write up here: http://livinlite.proboards.com/thread/1150/flickr-tutorial
Please send me any comments or revisions if I missed anything. Only staff has the ability to post directly in the news/announcements senction
[quote source="/post/11553/thread" timestamp="1432753498" author="@charliem"][quote timestamp="1432752788" author="@fasteddieb" source="/post/11551/thread"]See this, which I just posted elsewhere:
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8677/15984474182_604b42dc1e_o.jpg)
[img style="max-width:100%;" src="https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7791/18145300676_bf4e2e845f_o.png"]
[p]Photobucket for the win. Limited free storage though.
Upload photo.
Left click copy direct
Paste as image in forum.
Go camping.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Wish Amazon Prime had that interface. I have unlimited storage there.[/p]
Flickr is usually pretty speedy in the Mac and iOS world.
Still a bit convoluted, but it works. Wish Apple or DropBox had a 1-click solution. I'd switch in a minute.
BTW, you might try Flickr again. The site was periodically down and slow earlier this afternoon.
[quote source="/post/11572/thread" timestamp="1432764190" author="@whoofit"][p]Photobucket for the win. Limited free storage though.
Upload photo.
Left click copy direct
Paste as image in forum.
Go camping.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Wish Amazon Prime had that interface. I have unlimited storage there.[/p][/quote]I've used less than 20% of the free storage over six years & over 1600 low resolution (75kb to 200kb) photos stored.
At this rate, will be years before using all of the free storage.
[quote timestamp="1432768466" author="@exploringcarolina" source="/post/11580/thread"][quote source="/post/11572/thread" author="@whoofit" timestamp="1432764190"][p]Photobucket for the win. Limited free storage though.
Upload photo.
Left click copy direct
Paste as image in forum.
Go camping.[/p][p]
[/p][p]Wish Amazon Prime had that interface. I have unlimited storage there.[/p][/quote]I've used less than 20% of the free storage over six years & over 1600 low resolution (75kb to 200kb) photos stored.
At this rate, will be years before using all of the free storage.
[/quote]I keep all my pictures on a 1tb hard drive and upload the picture I want to photobucket. You can always delete pictures from photobucket if you get concerned about storage. Though I agree it would take years or a heck of a lot of high resolution pictures to ever use the free storage allotment.
[quote source="/post/11582/thread" author="@david" timestamp="1432770978"]Looks like the camera put on a few pounds ;-).
[/quote]Well, I think the dog looks just fine!
May try Photobucket.
One advantage to Flickr for Mac and iOS users is a button in iPhoto and Photos on iOS to upload to Flickr.
Have to see how that would work out with Photobucket.
via Photobucket:
(just offhand not seeing how to choose a smaller image size)
(http://i1072.photobucket.com/albums/w378/fasteddieb2/image.jpg1_zpsnhwsq7v4.jpg)
Saving a space for experimenting
EDIT: Okay, I think I can get this happening from the Ipad, now.
url=https://flic.kr/p/tiNbXo]
[img style="max-width:100%;" src="https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7735/17923025172_840dabcd50_c.jpg"]
[/url][a href="https://flic.kr/p/tiNbXo"]2014 Camplite 16DBS[/a] by [a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/96992642@N04/"]Kathleen Sheridan[/a], on Flickr
if you would like a smaller image displayed when posting, link the photo as normal from photobucket (or wherever) and then coose the "bbcode tab at the bottom of the create post window you are in
you will see something like this (with brackets on each end, i put it in bold to point it out)
img style="" src="http://i350.photobucket.com/albums/q439/mushr00min/rzr/frontcorner2_zps95962869.jpg" style="max-width:100%;"
simply change the percentage to the percentage of the original picture you would like it displayed at (percentage location will be based on the host you are linking from).
here is 100%
(http://i350.photobucket.com/albums/q439/mushr00min/rzr/frontcorner2_zps95962869.jpg)
(http://i350.photobucket.com/albums/q439/mushr00min/rzr/frontcorner2_zps95962869.jpg)
[p]Images. Just cuz images are so cool. So important for a forum. It's worth the effort.[/p][p]
[/p][p]
(http://i1312.photobucket.com/albums/t521/minuteman1965/10649089_1518158488432599_6433535200342884846_o_zpsic23lq0d.jpg)
(http://i1312.photobucket.com/albums/t521/minuteman1965/994463_1478543469060768_6545440519548347017_n_zpsxmuixr3k.jpg)
(http://i1312.photobucket.com/albums/t521/minuteman1965/10514699_1478546625727119_5944437667224258546_n_zps2cwmpjnb.jpg)
(http://i1312.photobucket.com/albums/t521/minuteman1965/10530716_1479964372252011_6559336096221828633_n_zpshmgqp2li.jpg)
(http://i1312.photobucket.com/albums/t521/minuteman1965/10534563_1478550359060079_2729108533665616858_n_zps3jwjlxvl.jpg)
[quote source="/post/11607/thread" timestamp="1432812171" author="@whoofit"][p]Images. Just cuz images are so cool. So important for a forum. It's worth the effort[/p][p]
[/p][/quote]Nice Shots!!!!!
[a href="http://s657.photobucket.com/user/vstromklr/media/Camping%202014/IMG_4590_zps9ce7f914.jpg.html"]
(http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu299/vstromklr/Camping%202014/IMG_4590_zps9ce7f914.jpg)
thudd3r,
that works - thanks!
I think I still prefer how Flickr gives you multiple image size choices when you grab the link.
(http://i1072.photobucket.com/albums/w378/fasteddieb2/image.jpg1_zpsnhwsq7v4.jpg)
[quote timestamp="1432813292" author="@exploringcarolina" source="/post/11608/thread"]
Quote from: @whoofit" timestamp="1432812171" source="/post/11607/thread[p]Images. Just cuz images are so cool. So important for a forum. It's worth the effort[/p][p]
[/p]
Nice Shots!!!!!
[/quote]Bill, while trying not to sound too mushy here, I value forums for their ability to allow me to view the world, both in words and pics, through the eyes of folks like you. It's just too big of a place to cover alone... I'm sure it was the grand design.
[quote source="/post/11602/thread" author="@kath" timestamp="1432786475"]Saving a space for experimenting
EDIT: Okay, I think I can get this happening from the Ipad, now.
url=https://flic.kr/p/tiNbXo]
(https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7735/17923025172_840dabcd50_c.jpg)
[quote source="/post/11610/thread" timestamp="1432814476" author="@whoofit"][quote source="/post/11608/thread" timestamp="1432813292" author="@exploringcarolina"]Nice Shots!!!!!
[/quote]Bill, while trying not to sound too mushy here, I value forums for their ability to allow me to view the world, both in words and pics, through the eyes of folks like you. It's just too big of a place to cover alone... I'm sure it was the grand design.
[/quote]Agree & Thanks!
Photos are a very important part of forums for us!
Lots of places to see & not enough time. Use forums for tech applications, beautiful scenery, neat places & folks. Wear out a point & shoot every couple years. Buying a better camera before the next visit up north & out west.
The scanner broke, but took a photo of our possible next camper, if LL will build it:
[a href="http://s657.photobucket.com/user/vstromklr/media/2015/IMG_7141_zpsjrxqsvuf.jpg.html"]
(http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu299/vstromklr/2015/IMG_7141_zpsjrxqsvuf.jpg)
.
The scanner broke, but took a photo of our possible next camper, if LL will build it:
[a href="http://s657.photobucket.com/user/vstromklr/media/2015/IMG_7141_zpsjrxqsvuf.jpg.html"]
[img style="max-width:100%;" src="http://i657.photobucket.com/albums/uu299/vstromklr/2015/IMG_7141_zpsjrxqsvuf.jpg"][/a]
[/quote][br
This is an interesting design. If LL can work out the weight distribution, then they will probably build it.
I often wonder how much consideration is given to side to side weight distribution at LL. On ours the water heater, sofa, furnace, converter, AC, exterior storage and shower are all piled up on one side. The fridge, spare tire, microwave and rear closet on the other.
Since I like to measure I've searching for a decent used axle scale to compliment my TW scale. Just for kicks.
Sorry to the OP for the OT.... yo.
Will start another thread when we are close to ordering from LL!
I will get back on topic!
Got that far just could not get it to paste.
[quote timestamp="1432833282" author="@ammobob" source="/post/11638/thread"]Got that far just could not get it to paste.[/quote]Sorry, had to delete my post, too much quoting. Anyway, when you get to the reply page, not quick reply, hit the Bb button and hold down your finger like a regular paste. That's how it finally worked for me, but haven't tried it again since.
It's my birthday today, so we're celebrating, but will try it out again later or tomorrow. Good luck! Btw Fasteddie seems to have this process down.
Happy Birthday, Kath! Blessed be!
Google is having their annual I/O conference as we speak. I was watching it streaming a while ago.
Lots of new stop but of interest to this thread is new Google photos. The big thing is they're offering unlimited free photo storage.
And a lot of fascinating tools for organizing your photos as well. It remains to be seen out linkable those photos will be but I for one am certainly going to check it out.
[font size="3"]A few random comments re third party hosting:
Another optional picture hosting site is [a href="http://imgur.com"]ingur.com[/a]. It is apparently a huge image posting site and is used by the Good Sam site, RV.net. The interface is similar to Photobucket in that you register for an account, upload your pix, select and copy the BB code, and paste the code into our PB reply. I tried it for a while and got no popups at all.
I also have a photobucket account. I have not been bothered by popups, but my account is associated with my paid AOL mail account. I'm in the process of converting my AOL mail account to free so that may bring on the popups. Stay tuned for news.
On photobucket you can set the size for out linked images. I created a sub-album just for CL pictures. I can set the download size to anything I want, probably 640x480 or 800x600. Still not a nice as the cick to expand feature built in to PB, but..........
[/font]
I downloaded the Google Images app to my iPhone and iPad.
It appears to be a carefully crafted and elegant way to store, back up, edit and organize your photos.
Bad news is right now I don't see a way to link to actual images. There is a "Copy Link" option, but that link goes to a page where the image displays, not the image itself.
So, I'm still stuck with Flickr.
Seeing what I could do with just my iPad. Figured it out.[a href="http://s304.photobucket.com/user/bvabob1/media/Our%20New%20Camper/image.jpg1_zpscokukd8l.jpg.html"]
(http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn197/bvabob1/Our%20New%20Camper/image.jpg1_zpscokukd8l.jpg)
Ammobob, was the iPad experiment using the Google Photos App?
I just attempted to fight my way through Flickr setup and usage for posting photos. I'm no Luddite with electronics (apologies to Luddites), but frankly, I gave up. To go through that mess every time I want to post a quick photo is just too much. I suppose regular users of Flickr are fine with it and maybe there's a better way to use Flickr photo sharing with my Mac, but I'm going to explore Photobucket next.
Photo bucket is easy...you can even drag and drop onto the page to upload. Once it is on photo bucket you can copy the link and use it on the forum. I copy the direct link and paste it into the link photo box on the forum. That way the forum adds the right formatting and tags
[quote timestamp="1433030473" author="@sandroad" source="/post/11756/thread"]Ammobob, was the iPad experiment using the Google Photos App?
I just attempted to fight my way through Flickr setup and usage for posting photos. I'm no Luddite with electronics (apologies to Luddites), but frankly, I gave up. To go through that mess every time I want to post a quick photo is just too much. I suppose regular users of Flickr are fine with it and maybe there's a better way to use Flickr photo sharing with my Mac, but I'm going to explore Photobucket next. [/quote]No I opened another session in photobucket and copied the BB code from there and pasted it in. Wanted to be able to use my IPad or iPhone to post trip pictures without having a PC or laptop traveling with me. The process is a bit of a pain but not too bad. Flickr works when you are at a PC but not with my iPad.
Of course the whole purpose is to be mobile and not waiting until you get home to dump all your pictures onto a PC so you can do a batch upload.
took picture with I Pad, opened window with photobucket, saved pic to photobucket and then processed it for attachment. Once on the forum (which is where I was having my pasting issues) I found that I needed to be on the BB tab and have the keyboard up on my iPad to get it to paste but it worked. Been experimenting with any way I could do this and this works for me.
Of course this is a 1 picture at a time process but if you were doing a trip it would work. To post multiple picture you would need your PC or a laptop. I have a blog set up in Blogger/Google+ and will just attach the link as another means of sharing camper delivery pictures mid June and then our 8 day Yellowstone camping trip during our return trip to Nevada. Picking up camper on the 15th of June so we'll see how this process goes. Will post pics and process problems next month as we start this journey.